I ask you for advice on some speakers.

[Fa Favanes]

Good morning everyone,

I need to redo the audio system at home and I wanted to ask for your advice as I would like a completely different sound from what I have had so far, and I thought of asking you as you seem very knowledgeable The room is about 20 sqm and I would like a system that gives me all the live energy, I want the guitars to roar and have that beautiful electric sound that takes your breath away when I listen to a rock/metal song at high volume, and I want the bass to give me that classic punch in the stomach. I want the instruments to have all their presence, a full and engaging sound that is also fun. All details must be of at least very good quality. In general, I prefer a big sound, I can't stand speakers that give microscopic sounds anymore. On the other hand, I also need to be able to listen to music well at low volume at a closer distance, without hiss. The listening position may vary, if I listen at low volume it can be one meter, if I listen at high volume 3 m. As for width, I would like to be able to stay at around 43 cm. I listen to all genres, it must also be good for electronic music, EDM, jazz, and acoustic.
Initially, I thought of a JBL system, either 4429 + subwoofer or a full-range floor speaker that does not need a sub but still gives me deep and full bass. Or the s3900 or array 1400.

Then I saw this video:

I have listened to various hi-fi systems in stores, including systems worth 30,000 €. The last one was a pair of Sonus Faber worth 10,000 € with a Macintosh system worth 20,000 €, excluding the source. The volume could also be very loud, but it lacked that feeling of realism, aggressiveness, and live dynamics. I also considered active ATCs, I know they are very accurate and are used in recording studios, but from what I have read they lack those bass and mid-range frequencies that music requires to unleash its true energy.

Anyway, starting from that point, I did some research and saw some discussions on Meyer Sound and then Danley amplified speakers. Moreover, with an amplified system, I would also solve the problem of coupling with an amplifier and save space in the room, using much fewer cables. All advantages that appeal to me a lot.

As for the source, I will use streaming, but also many ripped CDs and I will probably also try Blu-rays and SACDs. So, I wanted to ask if you think Meyer Sound or Danley speakers could be the ideal solution and if you could recommend some models! Or any other brand that you think is suitable. Last two things, I would obviously also ask for an installation and sound setup service by a technician, as for the budget, I don't know yet, if possible, I would like to be around 8000\10,000 €. This means that if I spend 5000 € I'm happier, but if I find something extraordinary and definitive at 12,000 € I can reflect on it carefully.

Thank you, have a nice day!

 

[Paul Johnson]

You are very mixed up in your focus here. I have in stock a 12 box JBL VRX system, It has the sort of bass that you feel and is really in your face - for live shows. It does it's job well and earns its keep.

However - it is not remotely accurate and revealing. It kicks ar5e. If you want a system that will play almost anything then you need precision, truth, accuracy and frequency extension.

I'm also totally confused by your measurements? You listen a 3m but want half a metre between them?

You have silly money to spend and realistically, what you want is NOT what hifi systems do. A roaring guitar or a beautiful electric sound makes no sense. You want a system that gives out what is put in, but you want a certain sound, and that is NOT Hifi.

Hifi needs carefully tuned acoustics and a minimum speaker separation to give you, with eyes close, a drum kit that is the right size. You need mid field distances to hear stereo properly and even 3m could be considered too close if the room is big? 1m is verging on near field, with all the compromises that closeness gives. It also introduces spatial separation. Your brain can tell the HF and LF drivers are not in the same place.

Throwing money at it will not create what you want, because what you want is NOT normal hifi, so the usual products may fail to impress.

Despite multiple 18" subs, in my studio the monitors are 8"/1" and there are no subs, just nice sounding speakers. I cannot make my diaphragm thrash with bass, and guitars sound like, well, guitars - good ones and poor ones.

With today's better sampling and bit depth, CDs may well be a compromise. The entire system only being as good as the weakest link.

You've got an idea in your head, compiled from so many sources the info is contradictory.

You could buy a PA that will make your guts wobble and ears bleed, but that is not quality audio I'm afraid. Your budget is frankly silly for anyone who has not spent lots on controlled acoustics in the space. That is equally as important as the equipment.

Pro gear is available for short term rental, so why not chat with the local PA company and spend a bit on a hire of a PA with subs so you can see how you like it.

 

[Fa Favanes]

Hi Paul, first of all thank you for your reply, but please don't get irritated, I came here just to clarify my ideas and ask for advice

I will make a few clarifications so that I can better understand: the distance between the two speakers is 2 m and the listening point is almost 3 m. The room is not very reflective and the wall opposite the speakers has been treated with sound-absorbing material.

The budget I have indicated is the maximum but I have clearly specified that it is the maximum effort I can make, of course if I can spend less for the ideal result I am quite happy!
I It should be kept in mind that that amount is for a new product, so a used one could cost significantly less. They don't sound like silly money to me at all, if I understand your nuance correctly. I am not a native speaker and may have misunderstood.

Precisely because I know what hi-fi sounds like, I'm looking for something that goes a bit further and also manages to restore the live energy. Of course I want the system to sound good at low volume but I also want it to sound loud without distortion and for the instruments to lighten in their presence. Is that such a strange and impossible request? I don't know if I have managed to explain myself.

So I'm trying to find out whether among brands like Meyer there are any active loudspeakers that have a very good quality while still having the sound presentation characteristics typical of PAs.

Thanks for your patience and advice

 

[Paul Johnson]

I'm not irritated, but the concept of quality PA and hifi simply do not go together. What I mean is that you seem to think that buy-in g Meyer or other similar products means it's better than a decent hifi system? They were very much different beasts. Hifi is chosen so that what goes in, comes out largely untouched apart from volume. PA systems are designed to throw large amounts of sound a distance, and not to be listened to in the near field. Physically, these boxes are large, or they stack together to become large. Mainly for power handling really. One speaker on its own, fired up in my studio sounds pretty horrible just ticking over. Turn it up in a big space and they change character. If you know what hifi sounds like, do NOT expect this type of sound from a PA. It's really like a low sports car vs a 4WD with chunky tyres. Same power output, but wildly different.

I really have never ever heard a quality piece of home audio that sounds like a PA. In fact, I do a lot of trade shows and they often have speaker demo rooms where big PAs are set up and people can hear the same music played on them all in sequence. None sound like a hifi, but from what you stated, you want PA sound to wobble the stomach and knock you over with the wind! If you want studio monitors you would buy one brand and if you want a PA you buy another. You may well be chasing unicorns - a sort of Don Quixote mission that you cannot win. Your room is really small, so the sound from a PA system will sounds very strange If we also assume your height is restricted too, being in that space with a powerful PA will be quite unpleasant.

 

[David Scarlett]

Maybe quality studio monitors could be the right compromise for this situation, something from Dynaudio, Genelec, or Barefoot?

 

[Fa Favanes]

ok

I'm not irritated, but the concept of quality PA and hifi simply do not go together.

I see. Thank you. In fact that's exactly the problem, I'm looking for a product for the home that gives that live pleasure... I was simply hoping that there was a product that could fulfil this desire.

Maybe quality studio monitors could be the right compromise for this situation, something from Dynaudio, Genelec, or Barefoot?

In fact that's what I was considering, the problem here too is finding a pair that can restore the instruments to life size and have good body and can engage...
I have already listened to focal monitors but although they have many qualities they sound too cold and thin for me...

 

[Paul OBrien]

Certainly you don't need to a PA line array in your house, but you may like the sound of a PA style cab with large high efficiency drivers powered by high quality home audio amplifiers. I have always felt that it takes big speakers to produce big sound and clearly I'm not the only one as there is a forum dedicated to just this.. the High Effiency Speaker Asylum. Many of the drivers used in a system like this are lifted directly from the Pro audio industry but in use they are rarely pushed anywhere near their maximum power ratings, in fact it is the amount of SPL that can be generated with only 5-10w that is the attraction, the sound has an effortless quality about it.
I stumbled into this by accident in the late 70's with my first DIY speaker build that was a classic 3-way monkey coffin design with a high efficiency 15" bass driver, the amplifier that powered these speakers only produced 65w/ch but most times it ran in the 1-10w range, and I was hooked. You can get an idea of what this is all about if you were to rent some PA speakers to demo, but while you may like some aspects of the sound produced it takes a different approach to powering and processing to make something you can listen to in a home environment. A PA speaker is designed to get really loud and not blow up, in the home environment that isn't a problem usually and more attention needs to be put into keeping background noise down and developing processing tailored to relatively low SPL listening.

 

[Paul Johnson]

I'm convinced that few real PA speakers have flat frequency response as a design feature. It's not what PA is about. Studio monitors have frequency responses that allow accurate and delicate adjustment of EQ, balance, stereo imaging, compression and quality. PA systems don't and often artificially push things. Crossover frequencies move certain instruments in a mix from one drive section to another so alter their location, and of course you get that weird omni sub woofer sound that you don't want in studio monitors.

There's nothing wrong with PA being used, but my big rig in the store at the volume possible in there simply sounds feeble with the meters hardly ticking over. Drive it close to max and it's a totally different sound that really kicks. It just cannot do that at low volumes.