Thoughts on old EAW KF gear

M

Marlon Daniel

Freshman
Mar 6, 2012
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Upper Marlboro, MD
First off, Happy Holidays Soundforums.net

Now, the question.

I am seeing the market flooded with alot of used EAW KF gear (KF850, KF650e/i/z, KF300i/z).

As a weekend warrior who does christian/gospel events (i.e. may not need 115 db at 75' FOH in nothing larger than a "gymatorium" with 900 packed to capacity), would looking into these boxes be a feasible route? I have done 2 VRX932 per side and the coverage was great for me (just WOW those boxes are bright!!). I already have a pair of SB1000z, which while are heavy are the step up from the SRX718s that I will use for smaller productions (500 total capcacity, 105 db at 50'). The weight doesn't bother me (i am 35, and I always have help). Being a musician I am really big on sound quality at this point, and if investing in used KF stuff will give the quality that I am looking for at this point then I can use this until I can afford a pair of Danley SH50s 8)~:cool:~:cool:.

Thanks Soundforums.net!

MGD
 
Re: Thoughts on old EAW KF gear

It's all solid gear. Anything that has greybox presets for the UX8800 can still be considered a modern box, and the older gear sounds quite good with standard DSP (or in some cases, even without).

If I were in your position, I'd be looking at the 650s, as the 850 is more than you need, and the 300 isn't enough for those rooms (think of it as a nice speaker on a stick)
 
Re: Thoughts on old EAW KF gear

Marlon Daniel said:
Being a musician I am really big on sound quality at this point, and if investing in used KF stuff will give the quality that I am looking for at this point then I can use this until I can afford a pair of Danley SH50s 8)~:cool:~:cool:.



MGD
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In many cases a pair of SH50's (1 per side) is not going to provide a wide enough coverage for many venues. For others it is fine.

If you are looking at Danley-then I suggest the SM80. Wider coverage-lighter-pole mountable-less expensive and just as loud or louder.

You will need subs with the SM80 (in many cases but not all)-and you already have some-so you are in a good position there. Except you will need more subs if you want to keep up with the SM80.
 
Re: Thoughts on old EAW KF gear

Ivan Beaver said:
In many cases a pair of SH50's (1 per side) is not going to provide a wide enough coverage for many venues. For others it is fine.

If you are looking at Danley-then I suggest the SM80. Wider coverage-lighter-pole mountable-less expensive and just as loud or louder.

You will need subs with the SM80 (in many cases but not all)-and you already have some-so you are in a good position there. Except you will need more subs if you want to keep up with the SM80.
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I can't believe I never noticed that on the Danley site. Yes, I am always trying to find "just right porridge" speaker from gyms. This looks like a good bet. Being stand mountable is just an added bonus, since getting 2 KF650s per side in a gym above the heads of the church folk (they want the speakers no lower than 8.5 ft) can be challenge if you want to avoid the wonderful world of rigging and/or scaffolds.
 
Re: Thoughts on old EAW KF gear

Marlon Daniel said:
I can't believe I never noticed that on the Danley site. Yes, I am always trying to find "just right porridge" speaker from gyms. This looks like a good bet. Being stand mountable is just an added bonus, since getting 2 KF650s per side in a gym above the heads of the church folk (they want the speakers no lower than 8.5 ft) can be challenge if you want to avoid the wonderful world of rigging and/or scaffolds.
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Just go ahead and get the Danleys. Find a way to float the cost, enjoy the results now and avoid frittering away a portion of your $$$$ on sequential gear-swaps. Be sure to add in a pair of Nimrod Weber's "Balanced Speaker Tilters".........
 
Re: Thoughts on old EAW KF gear

Well I am going to have to visit the Danley shop the next time I am in the Atlanta area. Now I have to decide between two SM80s and an ITECH 9000HD. Decisions!! Thanks for the info and advice!
 
Re: Thoughts on old EAW KF gear

This ought to be interesting. I started writing then did a little research on the SM80. I will go ahead and post what I have.

+1 on the KF650z. In my opinion you can't go wrong with this box for what you are doing. I have used the KF650e's over SB1000's and liked them ok and the KF650z's over Danley TH212's and loved them. The z's are stellar, a completely different animal than the e series. Just be sure to get them up high enough because the high frequency driver is in the middle. Also amp power and processing are critical to get the most out of them. Get the UX8800 and tri-amp them if you really want the very best sound quality and output. If you are looking at anything Danley for top boxes, a properly powered and processed KF650z rig is one of the very few semi affordable professional set ups that will even get you close to that high end studio monitor sound and accuracy. The KF850, although much louder, is a very heavy box. It is in excess of 250lbs. I did not like lifting them when I was 35 and I like lifting 250lb trap boxes even less now at 50 (even though I still do it on our bigger shows).

Now as for the SM80. I was unaware of this box. After researching a little bit I am going to have to take a ride over to Danley and give a listen to them. 50lbs pole mountable with a 134db peak at 80 degrees seems almost unfathomable. I am a big fan of the KF650z but if you do the math 3 amps and a ux8800, even used, puts the price in range of the SM80 and a single amp. Just for comparison my Mackie Fussion 3000 tops are supposedly 135db peak with a 80x70 degree pattern and they will walk all over a single KF650z. They are LOUD and fairly accurate. There is just that 250lb thing that makes me always wish for other options. The crossover point is 85hz for the Fussions rather than 120HZ for the SM80 but I have a truck load of subs that will be happy to go up to 120hz and crossover. I am actually in the market myself for a smaller trap rig to add to my arsonal sometime around February and I had pretty much decided to either go with the KF650z's or a 3 way powered option. I don't expect a smaller cabinet to be as loud as the Fussion 3000 but it is a reference for me as far as clarity and volume. It might be an apples and oranges comparison but would like do a shootout with the 650z's, Fussion 3000's, and the SM80's in the next few weeks Ivan if you have the time. I called Kemper and he is in to bring his 650z rig.
 
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Re: Thoughts on old EAW KF gear

Eric Cagle said:
It might be an apples and oranges comparison but would like do a shootout with the 650z's, Fussion 3000's, and the SM80's in the next few weeks Ivan if you have the time. I called Kemper and he is in to bring his 650z rig.
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The best way would be to do a side by side demo-and we welcome side by sides. It is the best way to truly get an idea of how different cabinets compare to each other.

I will not be back in the office until Jan 7th ( I have a Synaudcon class in Dallas the first week.). Give me a call-and bring whatever you want to compare. Drag Kemper if you can.
 
Re: Thoughts on old EAW KF gear

Ivan Beaver said:
The best way would be to do a side by side demo-and we welcome side by sides. It is the best way to truly get an idea of how different cabinets compare to each other.

I will not be back in the office until Jan 7th ( I have a Synaudcon class in Dallas the first week.). Give me a call-and bring whatever you want to compare. Drag Kemper if you can.
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That sounds good. I am available most any week day after the 7th with some notice. I will also bring you that amp and stack of 1970's and 80's audio brochures I have been saving for your museum.
-Eric
 
Re: Thoughts on old EAW KF gear

Eric Cagle said:
That sounds good. I am available most any week day after the 7th with some notice. I will also bring you that amp and stack of 1970's and 80's audio brochures I have been saving for your museum.
-Eric
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Great! Give me a call at the main Danley # 770-535-0204 and ask for me.
 
If this shoot our happens, I could bring a pair of vp7335dp to compare with. I'm still interested in hearing the sm80 under more favorable circumstances.

Sent from my neural implant
 
Re: Thoughts on old EAW KF gear

I hate to throw a damper on things, because I do love the Danley stuff. But "80 degree box" and "gymnatorium" put together might result in a nasty reverberant mess, unless you're in places with some acoustic treatment. Something with a tighter vertical pattern would probably be a better fit for the application.
 
Re: Thoughts on old EAW KF gear

Scott Helmke said:
I hate to throw a damper on things, because I do love the Danley stuff. But "80 degree box" and "gymnatorium" put together might result in a nasty reverberant mess, unless you're in places with some acoustic treatment. Something with a tighter vertical pattern would probably be a better fit for the application.
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Well I think this thread has kinda gone off on a slight tangent where a shootout with the SM80 is in the works. But that is a GREAT tangent. Honestly, I have tried to convince some of these facilities to at least have some rolls of carpet that can be used for productions but I haven't gotten traction on that.

I find few boxes that have "gymatorium" written all over them. Please correct me if I am wrong, but the bigger contendors might be the QRX212 and the SRX722 with their nominal 75x50 patterns. The KF650 being a little narrower, I would have to actually try it out in there and see how it works. But then that brings me back to getting a 135lb cab high enough that it doesn't take off Sister Mildred's best Sunday wig. I am just happy to see all this information going around. Very educational!
 
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