Acoustic guitar pickups

Re: Acoustic guitar pickups

The only thing I can add to this, is if the muso is singing whilst playing, I will always try to add something like an AT3031 or similar pencil condenser, on a claw, attached to their vocal mic stand. Then the D.I. goes to the wedges, and both get used out front, with the mic filling in a bit of the body that gets lost in the direct translation.



I personally play a small body maple Taylor, with an active LR-Baggs Undersaddle model pickup (no controls onboard at all). Even though this pickup sounds pretty great, the guitar still sounds 100% different from using a mic, and with such a small body guitar, any change in the tone that I hear, dramatically changes how I play.



I think this is a function more of being a percussive (finger) style player, but either way, if the low end gets changed from what I am used to... it totally changes everything about my approach. Dynamics, attack, sustain (on the low end especially) are all suddenly responding differently then what I am used to... and it can be very difficult to adjust to on the fly with quicker more intricate finger pickin' tunes.



I would suggest carrying at very least, a feedback buster to try if the artist doesn't carry one... they can be a life saver. I have also seen a countryman lav used (with fantastic results) in a pinch.. being gaffed just out of the way near the bridge and pick-guard, pointed toward the sound-hole... although I think your mileage with that trick may vary depending on the SPL situation you are dealing with on various gigs.

 
Re: Acoustic guitar pickups

Dick,



I own Takamine and Taylor acoustics. Both are acoustic / electric. I've never been pleased with the output of the Tak but well pleased with the Taylor expression system. The Tak has a pickup in the bridge, making it sound more ''banjo like''.



+1



I often wonder if those who buy guitars to perform live ever consider the sound of the pickup when they're demoing guitars in the shop. Some of the Takamine's I've worked with sound good from 3 feet away, but not so good when through the PA.



Since I'm not providing instruments for the musicians it really doesn't matter which one has the best pickup built in. What I'm looking for is the best way to dilute the crap and come up with something even marginally usable.



Two apparent solutions are:



1. Insertable DPEQ, possibly with presets for common problems.



2. Alternative pickup/mic to be quickly mounted for use. I have some AT Pro7a's that I usually use for violins/fiddles that may suffice just thrown into the guitar. The only thing I'd have to fabricate would be some kind of cover for the cord so as to keep it conveniently out of the way of the player. I've seen the cord run right along the fingerboard to keep it out of the way. I'll be looking for some kind of tube or the equivalent to keep it stiff and straight. A bit of transducer putty ought to hold it in place with no damage to the instrument.



The advantage to adding my own transducer/mic is that the player can no longer change settings once they've started playing. It's a rare player who doesn't fiddle with the sliders on these guitars between tunes.....or during.



Dick, if you haven't already tried it, try the blend concept externally, with a high GBF mic in addition to the onboard pickup. If the guitarist will stay reasonably close to the mic, the resulting sound would certainly be more pleasing than otherwise.



I use the internal mic-plus-pickup Fishman Rare Earth Blend for my Yairi, and in venues where I'm able to use all or at least 75% of the signal from the internal mic, it sounds very authentic.



In your case, getting whatever degree of signal you can from the mic would make the overall sound suck less.

 
Re: Acoustic guitar pickups

Dick, if you haven't already tried it, try the blend concept externally, with a high GBF mic in addition to the onboard pickup. If the guitarist will stay reasonably close to the mic, the resulting sound would certainly be more pleasing than otherwise.



I they'd play into a mic I wouldn't have the problem. I call them the ''wandering wannabe's''. They have to do the cool thing and by mic free, strolling or running around to mug with the drummer or the bass player or (horror) there are two of them with some kind of weird confrontational choreography, going head to head to egg each other on. You know who they are......



Rant over.
 
Re: Acoustic guitar pickups

Dick,

you just described 3/4 of the groups with an acoustic guitar that played at my old club gig.
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Re: Acoustic guitar pickups

The only thing I can add to this, is if the muso is singing whilst playing, I will always try to add something like an AT3031 or similar pencil condenser, on a claw, attached to their vocal mic stand. Then the D.I. goes to the wedges, and both get used out front, with the mic filling in a bit of the body that gets lost in the direct translation...



...I would suggest carrying at very least, a feedback buster to try if the artist doesn't carry one... they can be a life saver. I have also seen a countryman lav used (with fantastic results) in a pinch.. being gaffed just out of the way near the bridge and pick-guard, pointed toward the sound-hole... although I think your mileage with that trick may vary depending on the SPL situation you are dealing with on various gigs.



great suggestions. i've used both and they can work great. truth is, all acoustic pickups sound bad. so you're basically always in the 'fecal enhancement' biz when you're dealing with them...



for my personal acoustic sound, i gave up trying to make it sound like an actual acoustic guitar and just went with making it sound good, much like we've long left the sound of real drums behind in search of ever larger cannon shots. so i added a bunch of eq, a bit of compression, some chorus, a touch of verb, and voila...

here's a sample, for those care about such things. this guitar sound is straight off my processor that i plug into the PA.



a little advice for taks. if they've got the mid sweep eq on the guitar, put the freq at about 3k and cut about as much as you can. set treble at unity and boost the low to taste. that'll get you pretty close. anything else will sound really dreadful...



other rule of thumb with acoustics. you can't have too much eq available. they're worse than pianos. so don't be afraid to insert whatever you can find. and also don't be afraid to do pretty drastic stuff to them. that's usually what it takes...



have fun...



brian

 
Re: Acoustic guitar pickups

That mount also has a serious design flaw. I have managed to have 3 fall apart, and another band I know has a whole drawer full of them, all broken in the same way.



You can only warranty replace something so many times before you start to think why bother.
 
Re: Acoustic guitar pickups

Dick

I don't know if you have the coin
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but you may want to check out the DPA 4099 ($400) Sorry,I'm old school when it comes to transducers and agtr's
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixdv3mE98j8

Peace

Rob





The users I'm confronted with would knock that mounting off in about 30 seconds. So that is not practical. We're talking ''in the trenches'' here.

My condolences...
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Peace

Rob