Audience Mics for In-Ears

A

Adam Robinson

Sophomore
Jan 11, 2011
172
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16
Chicago IL
I spent the last four shows of my new tour playing around with audience mic'ing. The goal has been to keep my artist's ears in for the whole show when he wants to be immersed in the audience's reaction. In the end I had success but I want to make the experience better.

The application is large theatres up to arenas. I had two small diaphragm condenser mics on this last short run and while respectable mics, they fell short for what I was trying to do. Placing them on the corners of the stage misses the interaction front and center and also picks up too much fan chatter at the corners. I also am missing the ability to push audience interaction into the mix when they're singing along without adding too much of the PA into the mix.

I was thinking about putting two short shotguns and two short small diaphragm condensers at the corners of the stage - like a long-throw, short-throw system. I also have the option to hide a mic underneath a set of stairs mid-stage where I've got a straight shot to the audience (and the band is upstage of that point). Another thing might be to discretely place a small stereo mic downstage center in large venues where the audience is not right up to the edge of the stage... or what about putting a couple mics in the downstage lighting truss?

Does anyone have any more ideas or experiences (with shows of this type) to share?
 
Re: Audience Mics for In-Ears

adamrobinson said:
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... or what about putting a couple mics in the downstage lighting truss?
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This is an idea I have had for a while but have never got to put it to use. To add to Adam's question I would also like to know if a ducker would clean up an audience mic by removing it from the mix while the band is going full tilt.
 
Re: Audience Mics for In-Ears

Jay Barracato said:
This is an idea I have had for a while but have never got to put it to use. To add to Adam's question I would also like to know if a ducker would clean up an audience mic by removing it from the mix while the band is going full tilt.
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I do this manually. All of the band's monitor changes are covered in automation and I live on the artist's mix pretty much mixing the whole night. Audience mics come up and down as necessary but I'm not into the idea of the ducker because I've also been relying on the room noise to give me a natural reverb.
 
Re: Audience Mics for In-Ears

Does your singer use a mic stand? I have done well in the past with various mics attached to the stand. The best result was probably an omni lavalier with beltpack attached right to the stand, with a bit of foam at the element to prevent thumping. Yes, it is mono, but it seemed to give him a sense of space, generally relative to where he was. I have also done pairs of 56s clamped on to the stand, but it was a bit obtrusive and he found the reverse imaging when he turned around to face the band disconcerting.

Doesn't one of the major players in IEMs offer buds with some built in ambients with a separate volume control on the pack?

To answer Jay, I have found that with some artists, a ducker, keyed by an instrument only mix with slow attack and release times, and only about 5-10db of reduction, to be helpful. The trick is taking the time to make it sound natural to the artist, any pumping in the ears will quickly result in "pullouts" or complaints.
 
Re: Audience Mics for In-Ears

When my artist opened for Randy Travis, his ME had a single A-T boundary mic directly in front of Randy's mic stand - 3' deck height, but no crowd barriers. I didn't have a chance to note which model it was or how he had it processed, but the MON desk was a H3K with all the fun toys. I'd suspect that, given some of the engineer's moves during soundcheck, he was riding that fader between songs.
 
Re: Audience Mics for In-Ears

Ive done the omni on a mic stand trick as well, the advantage of it being mono is no displacement when the singer turns round on the stage, if you add it in to a little of the room mics you're using for ambience it should focus the crowd sound a suprising amount. I did this for a singer who also did some serious acrobatic dancing and she found a stereo crowd feed quite disorienting when she was running around the stage, she had a centre mic that she sang from and that's where the omni lived. G
 
Re: Audience Mics for In-Ears

I have been in the exact situation on past theater tours and had great success using a VP88 (I'd like to try a Royer in the future) down-stage center. I also used two shotgun mics, one far stage left/right. The singer I work for didn't move too much from DSC so I played with delay and polarity until they sounded good with the vocal mic open.
In arenas, I've found that you get too much audience bleed though the vocal mic to use audience mics a lot. When I do use them in arenas it's to give a wide stereo image to the audience. I'll usually delay one side a few milliseconds to widen the image.
In all situations I mix the audience in/out as needed.
 
Re: Audience Mics for In-Ears

My artist never stands still. The goal isn't to really localize what's going on, but to just immerse him in the screams and be able to get around the PA to pick up people singing lyrics when he's trying to hear that. When he wants to get up close and personal with the front row, he's still going to take an ear out. That will probably never change.

I think in the end, I'm just going to put up a bunch of things and experiment. Even if it means putting up the usual and then adding in a bunch of other stuff while I feed him what we've been doing so far.
 
Re: Audience Mics for In-Ears

I work with a Praise and Worship artist where if he is not hearing the audience response, he does not feel connected. I use shure SM89 shotguns on the corners of the stage about 7 feet off the deck, I will also use a LP claws on each shotgun stand and use either a 414 or a KSM 32 setup a little lower(maybe 4 feet off the deck) The 89's are run pretty hot all the time. The 414's I will ride a little bit more. I will also use a mic ISO so stage volume, drums, guitars, etc...do not bleed into the 414's.
http://www.proaudio.com/product_info.php?cPath=282_516&products_id=6825
 
Re: Audience Mics for In-Ears

I think I'm about to try something very similar. Shotguns and KM184s. Any recommendations on models of shotgun mics? Kyle, are you happy with the performance of the SM89?
 
Re: Audience Mics for In-Ears

I just did a show where the act used two Senny MKH 60'S Offstage L/R and two 414's DSC L/R. In addition they used two MKH60's on the B-stage.
Peace
 
Re: Audience Mics for In-Ears

at adam. sorry for the delay. busy touring schedule.... yes, i am happy with the shure sm 89. I have used AT and sennheiser shotguns also and they also work really well. just happens we have a shure endorsement so that is why i use the 89s.
 
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