Analog/Digital Return snake

S

Steve Payne

Junior
Jan 16, 2011
365
1
18
Richmond, VA
soundworksva.com
I am looking into adding the stage box and digital snake to our SC48. I will want to have separate returns for 8 analog and 8 AES digital lines.
Ideally I would like to be able to return all of these signals in one 300 ft. multipair cable with multi pin connectors. Does anyone make suitable multi pair cable for this application? (I know that I cannot run AES signals down long standard twisted pair , but can I run analog signals down 110 ohm AES twisted pair?) Thanks for any help.
 
Re: Analog/Digital Return snake

Steve Payne said:
(I know that I cannot run AES signals down long standard twisted pair , but can I run analog signals down 110 ohm AES twisted pair?)
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I've been using low capacitance, 110 Ohm cable for all the mic and line level cabling on my installed systems for well over 5 years now.

Are you looking to have CAT5e/6 STP cable(s) for the stage box along with the 8 analog and 8 AES audio lines all as part of the same multipair cable and multipin connector or just the audio?
 
Re: Analog/Digital Return snake

Thanks Kevin and Brad. I was thinking of running 3 separate CAT 5 lines terminated with ethercons along with 12 pair multi AES/analog terminated in LK37. I am looking for individually shielded 12 channel multipair AES cable if anyone has suggestions.
 
Re: Analog/Digital Return snake

Steve Payne said:
Thanks Kevin and Brad. I was thinking of running 3 separate CAT 5 lines terminated with ethercons along with 12 pair multi AES/analog terminated in LK37. I am looking for individually shielded 12 channel multipair AES cable if anyone has suggestions.
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Gepco makes a couple of 12pr individually jacketted multicable for AES. I have some AES mults that Ramtech made up using the DS612 cable which is 26awg. Just fits inside a cpc backshell so should fit in an LK no problem. They aren't 300 foot long return snakes, but are patched/unpatched and coiled up daily in their life as rack interconnects.
There is also a 24awg version DS412.

Gepco International, Inc. -- Audio and Video Cable Products -- is Gepco 4 pair tactical cat5e if that meets your needs.
 
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Re: Analog/Digital Return snake

In addition to the Gepco there is also Belden 1806F, Mogami 3163, Clark 812 and Rapco/Horizon VTG-AES/EBU-12PR. You might also want to consider using LK54 connectors and 16 pair cable in order to have some spares/redundacy.
 
Re: Analog/Digital Return snake

Bennett Prescott said:
Don't forget our friends at Link, who also make an AES audio pair and 2x Cat 5e snake solution!
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Just want to mention that Sommer Cable also have interesting mults with various cat/AES/DMX configurations, including some with a power run in the same jacket.

They also have released an interesting new multipin connector that will connect both signals and power in one plug.
 
Re: Analog/Digital Return snake

Steve Payne said:
I am looking into adding the stage box and digital snake to our SC48. I will want to have separate returns for 8 analog and 8 AES digital lines.
Ideally I would like to be able to return all of these signals in one 300 ft. multipair cable with multi pin connectors. Does anyone make suitable multi pair cable for this application? (I know that I cannot run AES signals down long standard twisted pair , but can I run analog signals down 110 ohm AES twisted pair?) Thanks for any help.
Click to expand...

How are you planning on populating the stage box? Why not put the output card (I am assuming you are using an xo16 or io16 output card) in the stage box along with 2 input card and for shows where you need more then 32 inputs use a separate input snake just for those shows.
 
Re: Analog/Digital Return snake

Kevin Maxwell said:
How are you planning on populating the stage box? Why not put the output card (I am assuming you are using an xo16 or io16 output card) in the stage box along with 2 input card and for shows where you need more then 32 inputs use a separate input snake just for those shows.
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The channel count for this system's use will regularly exceed 32 mic pres. The stage box will be loaded with 48 pres. Do not get me started on Avids decision to make this system expansion route limited to 3 I/O cards per box. it is what it is. Output cards will be AO16 and IO16. It is looking like the system will be regularly paired with a Midas Pro 2. When the dust has settled, the final snake configuration will allow for either of these consoles to be used at either end of the snake with no reconfiguring. Thanks to all for their cable suggestions.
 
Re: Analog/Digital Return snake

Steve Payne said:
The channel count for this system's use will regularly exceed 32 mic pres. The stage box will be loaded with 48 pres. Do not get me started on Avids decision to make this system expansion route limited to 3 I/O cards per box. it is what it is. Output cards will be AO16 and IO16. It is looking like the system will be regularly paired with a Midas Pro 2. When the dust has settled, the final snake configuration will allow for either of these consoles to be used at either end of the snake with no reconfiguring. Thanks to all for their cable suggestions.
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Are you aware that with the Ethernet snake card (Ethernet AVB) that gets put in the SC48 it works with 2 stage boxes? There are 2 etherCon connectors for each box (redundancy) just don’t cross connect them, it won’t work. I don’t know the pricing and it is probably more then the snake you are looking at. You just populate the boxes with the cards from the SC48. That is probably an over simplification because I understand that it costs more to upgrade an older SC48 then the option of ordering it with a new SC48. I was told it is about $5,500 to add it to an existing SC48 and a $4,000 option when you buy a new SC48. I think those are the list prices. Just letting you know all of your options.
 
Re: Analog/Digital Return snake

Eric Stahl said:
Check out entertainmentmetals.com, they can make any cable you want & they often use the Syntax IP67 audio connectors from IO Lab Corp.
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Thanks for the suggestion, Eric. The original post is over 6 months old and this project was put to bed quite a while ago. I did want to acknowledge the we have used entertainment metals on several custom projects and their work has been top notch.
 
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