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Behringer Inuke 3000
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<blockquote data-quote="drew gandy" data-source="post: 97094" data-attributes="member: 880"><p>Re: Behringer Inuke 3000</p><p></p><p>I've finally gotten enough experience with the NU6000dsp to post a "review" of sorts. I have posted some complaints on the forum already, mostly just about the spl of the cooling fans. Here's my new list. A foreword: I've been using QSC PL236 amps for many years now as my primary amps. They have done pretty well for me (despite the one amp that quit during a show because of a diode leg failure). I mention them here for comparison as I was hoping that maybe the Behringers would work as supplements or even replacements for the QSCs eventually. <span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"><span style="color: #222222">A) The noise. And this time it's not the fans. There is considerable hiss on the output. This may not be as big a deal for different speakers since mine probably have more high frequency sensitivity than most. But I did a side by side comparison with the PL236. With the input knobs all the way down, I have to practically put my ear to the grill in order to hear the hiss with the QSC. With the Behringer I can hear it plainly 10+ feet away. Did I measure the noise profile between the 2 amps? No. But it's basically a white noise type of sound coming from the Behringer. For me this noise is a deal breaker. I can't use it on quiet corporate gigs or some of the religious events while driving tops; it's just too noisy. Now, I generally run all my subs on the "2" pins and tops on the "1" pins such that I run one NL4 cable from the amp to the speaker location and then a shorter NL2 cable from the sub to the top. I find it to be a convenient cabling and signal flow arrangement [and I have a theory about the delay between the sub and top signals helping even out the current draw of the amp as a whole]. So, if I run this Behringer amp for subs and use different amps for tops then my cabling gets more complicated. But, if I'm willing to make that change then how about subs?</span></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'">B<span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">) This amp won't drive lab subs. At least my testing so far says so. I think the issue is the power cutoff mentioned in the bench review linked above. I had this amp out for a July 4 gig. We had about 125' of 6/4 SO cord between land power and a distro box that landed right at the amps. Each power amp had it's own 20 A circuit. I found that when I started to push the amp hard with a single lab sub on each channel it would cutout. The VUs on the front of the amp would stop but the power indicators and lcd display were still on. I turned the power off and back on to get the signal back. I encountered this a few times (during system check) before I decided to experiment a little. Thinking it was the current limit issue noted in the bench test, I switched one lab sub from parallel drivers to series drivers and then boosted the level on that box a little bit. Not ideal but the amp didn't cut out after that. btw, I had 2 labs per side of the stage; one pair on the behringer amp and the other pair on #2 channels of PL236s. Each sub had it's own amp channel. And, the Behringer driven subs were on the end of about 100' of 12 ga speaker cable. If this was a low impedance shut down (short circuit protection) then I wouldn't have expected the amp to act fine when one channel of the amp still had a "low" impedance load. I also measured the voltage at the distro while we were cranking the test tracks. Very little variation so I don't think we were browning out. Obviously this wasn't scientific but real world and this failure has me sheepish about using it on subs. If I get a chance soon I will crank up some labs at the shop and see if I can recreate this problem. </span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">C) I've used this amp a few times on wedges or in other "utility" situations and have been frustrated that there isn't a parallel inputs option in the menu. Finally a light bulb went on in my head and I realized that if I put it into biamp mode but leave the filters off, it will do this useful function. Unfortunately, I think that this renders the channel 2 front panel volume control useless which means that balancing levels has to be done in a menu. So, a wye cable at the input is still a little more functional. But at least parallel can be accomplished without it.</span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">D) This is an old one but... when side by side with an idling PL236, the fan noise is considerably different both in level and character. The Behringer is simply noisy. </span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">E) This is an issue that a lot of amps, not to mention wireless receivers (I'm talking to you, Shure), have these days. The friction fit of an IEC cable is simply not a very good way to handle the power going into a critical piece of gear. I have the wire clips on some of my QSC amps and I find that they still wiggle loose over time. This Behringer doesn't appear to be any different.</span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">F) The VU meters are on the outsides of the volume knobs and sort of tilted inward. I found this to be a little less than helpful since you can't see both of them unless you are mostly on axis of the front panel. This is a minor gripe since a lot of amps don't even give you VU's but I thought I would mention it. </span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></span></span></p><p><span style="color: #000000"><span style="font-family: 'Arial'"><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">Additional note: </span><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">The specs don't </span><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">seem</span><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"> to tell the story here. The Behringer manual says >98db on the noise spec. The QSC has what I think is a quieter noise spec (-107db). Both numbers seem like reasonably low amounts of noise, at least if I'm understanding the Behringer spec correctly. I didn't expect this to be an issue. Also, </span><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">I found that the noise on the output is affected by the EQ in the dsp. I turned on a high shelving EQ (at about 350hz) and tried cranking it up and down. Lowering it by the 15db maximum seemed to knock a couple dbs off the noise level. Boosting it 15db seemed to boost the noise 15db. This tells me </span><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">there</span><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"> might be a couple sources of the noise. Some intrinsic to the amp and some happening before or even in the dsp (dither?). There's also the chance that I have a defective unit although it seems to pass signal just fine (except for the lab sub thing) and all the dsp functions seem to work. </span></span></span></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="drew gandy, post: 97094, member: 880"] Re: Behringer Inuke 3000 I've finally gotten enough experience with the NU6000dsp to post a "review" of sorts. I have posted some complaints on the forum already, mostly just about the spl of the cooling fans. Here's my new list. A foreword: I've been using QSC PL236 amps for many years now as my primary amps. They have done pretty well for me (despite the one amp that quit during a show because of a diode leg failure). I mention them here for comparison as I was hoping that maybe the Behringers would work as supplements or even replacements for the QSCs eventually. [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial] [/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][FONT=Verdana][COLOR=#222222]A) The noise. And this time it's not the fans. There is considerable hiss on the output. This may not be as big a deal for different speakers since mine probably have more high frequency sensitivity than most. But I did a side by side comparison with the PL236. With the input knobs all the way down, I have to practically put my ear to the grill in order to hear the hiss with the QSC. With the Behringer I can hear it plainly 10+ feet away. Did I measure the noise profile between the 2 amps? No. But it's basically a white noise type of sound coming from the Behringer. For me this noise is a deal breaker. I can't use it on quiet corporate gigs or some of the religious events while driving tops; it's just too noisy. Now, I generally run all my subs on the "2" pins and tops on the "1" pins such that I run one NL4 cable from the amp to the speaker location and then a shorter NL2 cable from the sub to the top. I find it to be a convenient cabling and signal flow arrangement [and I have a theory about the delay between the sub and top signals helping even out the current draw of the amp as a whole]. So, if I run this Behringer amp for subs and use different amps for tops then my cabling gets more complicated. But, if I'm willing to make that change then how about subs?[/COLOR][/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial] [/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial]B[FONT=Verdana]) This amp won't drive lab subs. At least my testing so far says so. I think the issue is the power cutoff mentioned in the bench review linked above. I had this amp out for a July 4 gig. We had about 125' of 6/4 SO cord between land power and a distro box that landed right at the amps. Each power amp had it's own 20 A circuit. I found that when I started to push the amp hard with a single lab sub on each channel it would cutout. The VUs on the front of the amp would stop but the power indicators and lcd display were still on. I turned the power off and back on to get the signal back. I encountered this a few times (during system check) before I decided to experiment a little. Thinking it was the current limit issue noted in the bench test, I switched one lab sub from parallel drivers to series drivers and then boosted the level on that box a little bit. Not ideal but the amp didn't cut out after that. btw, I had 2 labs per side of the stage; one pair on the behringer amp and the other pair on #2 channels of PL236s. Each sub had it's own amp channel. And, the Behringer driven subs were on the end of about 100' of 12 ga speaker cable. If this was a low impedance shut down (short circuit protection) then I wouldn't have expected the amp to act fine when one channel of the amp still had a "low" impedance load. I also measured the voltage at the distro while we were cranking the test tracks. Very little variation so I don't think we were browning out. Obviously this wasn't scientific but real world and this failure has me sheepish about using it on subs. If I get a chance soon I will crank up some labs at the shop and see if I can recreate this problem. [/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][FONT=Verdana]C) I've used this amp a few times on wedges or in other "utility" situations and have been frustrated that there isn't a parallel inputs option in the menu. Finally a light bulb went on in my head and I realized that if I put it into biamp mode but leave the filters off, it will do this useful function. Unfortunately, I think that this renders the channel 2 front panel volume control useless which means that balancing levels has to be done in a menu. So, a wye cable at the input is still a little more functional. But at least parallel can be accomplished without it.[/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][FONT=Verdana]D) This is an old one but... when side by side with an idling PL236, the fan noise is considerably different both in level and character. The Behringer is simply noisy. [/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][FONT=Verdana]E) This is an issue that a lot of amps, not to mention wireless receivers (I'm talking to you, Shure), have these days. The friction fit of an IEC cable is simply not a very good way to handle the power going into a critical piece of gear. I have the wire clips on some of my QSC amps and I find that they still wiggle loose over time. This Behringer doesn't appear to be any different.[/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][FONT=Verdana]F) The VU meters are on the outsides of the volume knobs and sort of tilted inward. I found this to be a little less than helpful since you can't see both of them unless you are mostly on axis of the front panel. This is a minor gripe since a lot of amps don't even give you VU's but I thought I would mention it. [/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR] [COLOR=#000000][FONT=Arial][FONT=Verdana]Additional note: [/FONT][FONT=Verdana]The specs don't [/FONT][FONT=Verdana]seem[/FONT][FONT=Verdana] to tell the story here. The Behringer manual says >98db on the noise spec. The QSC has what I think is a quieter noise spec (-107db). Both numbers seem like reasonably low amounts of noise, at least if I'm understanding the Behringer spec correctly. I didn't expect this to be an issue. Also, [/FONT][FONT=Verdana]I found that the noise on the output is affected by the EQ in the dsp. I turned on a high shelving EQ (at about 350hz) and tried cranking it up and down. Lowering it by the 15db maximum seemed to knock a couple dbs off the noise level. Boosting it 15db seemed to boost the noise 15db. This tells me [/FONT][FONT=Verdana]there[/FONT][FONT=Verdana] might be a couple sources of the noise. Some intrinsic to the amp and some happening before or even in the dsp (dither?). There's also the chance that I have a defective unit although it seems to pass signal just fine (except for the lab sub thing) and all the dsp functions seem to work. [/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR] [/QUOTE]
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