From small second stage to main stage?

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Kevin Boreing

Freshman
May 10, 2012
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I'm currently running a DJ setup consisting of 1 JBL PRX618S-XLF sub and 2 PRX 615M speakers. It also doubles as the mains for some weekend festival events on second stages, smaller church gigs, and bar gigs on the weekends.

I'd like to either add to this system or change around some to get to the level of a main stage at an outdoor local festival, maybe 1000 max in the coverage area. Most setups in this area run at least 4 subs a side and 2 large stage top boxes per side with off set dual 15's, or something similar, for these kind of events. My question is, do they make new speakers that fit this kind of bill anymore?

Anytime I go looking for a setup that would allow this kind of coverage, I find old touring setups or used boxes built 20 years ago. I'd like to invest in something that has newer drivers and tech along with better reproduction quality, but I would like to see some recommendations of what manufacturers are still making cabinets to fit this that are not flown or stack line array of some kind.

Suggestions? Might as well fly em and go small line array?
 
Re: From small second stage to main stage?

Welcome to the forum, Kevin.

For 1000 people? Get a total of 6 to 8 of those PRX618S-XLF subs in a center cluster plus something like 4 PRX625, 2 per side.

It's not going to be devastating, but plenty for the usual festival. Note: there is a lot more to providing production for 1000 people than just having the speakers to do it. You're obviously going to need consoles, snakes, mics, etc to handle the larger show, plus experience. Consider hiring a good engineer if you're unsure how to set it all up, the couple extra bucks spent will save you in the long run.

On another note, while you can still get them, 4 JBL SRX722 or 725 plus 4-6 SRX728S would have more get up and go. You'd need power though, something like 4 IT12000HD would do the trick.

There are 1000s of other options for rigs, which I'm sure this thread is going to show, but these are some quick and easy JBL options that work well with what you already have.
 
Re: From small second stage to main stage?

Kevin Boreing said:
I'm currently running a DJ setup consisting of 1 JBL PRX618S-XLF sub and 2 PRX 615M speakers. It also doubles as the mains for some weekend festival events on second stages, smaller church gigs, and bar gigs on the weekends.

I'd like to either add to this system or change around some to get to the level of a main stage at an outdoor local festival, maybe 1000 max in the coverage area. Most setups in this area run at least 4 subs a side and 2 large stage top boxes per side with off set dual 15's, or something similar, for these kind of events. My question is, do they make new speakers that fit this kind of bill anymore?

Anytime I go looking for a setup that would allow this kind of coverage, I find old touring setups or used boxes built 20 years ago. I'd like to invest in something that has newer drivers and tech along with better reproduction quality, but I would like to see some recommendations of what manufacturers are still making cabinets to fit this that are not flown or stack line array of some kind.

Suggestions? Might as well fly em and go small line array?
Click to expand...
How long is a piece of string? Which 1000 person event are you planning to do: 100 people an hour walking by for 10 hours? 1000 people at a screamo/ hip hop festival?

As Silas says, going beyond a couple hundred people is an exponential increase in cost, complexity, storage, and work. In my area, a legitimate sound company doing even a no-name outdoor moderate rock event where 1000+ people would attend would bring probably $150,000 worth of gear. This is what is required to do it well. If you don't need a rock concert out to 150' from the stage, you may likely be able to do with a lot less - it just depends on what you're trying to accomplish.

Line arrays are popular for lots of reasons - not all of them good. Done well they can sound better and provide more even coverage than equivalent trap boxes. Done inadequately/poorly and they are usually worse.

As to manufacturers making stacks, there are still a number of them. On the medium end:
JBL SRX
EV QRX
Yorkville TX
others

On the large end:
The brand new Nexo STM Nexo
EAW still makes new KF850s: EAW: KF850z
There are Turbosound Aspects: TA-890H Three-way loudspeaker : Turbosound
and others.

The problem is that these are all pretty big for an event of 250 people. There are a lot of systems that can do 0 - 350 people well - most SOS systems. There are a lot of systems that can do 350 - maybe 1000 - the JBL SRX722/725 series, EV QRX, etc., but these get pretty big to haul around for a smaller show, and get pretty stretched if you're serious about 1000 people. 750 people and up done well takes real gear, such as the boxes I linked above, or a reasonable line array.

Obviously the parameters of the coverage area, available mounting locations, and volume requirements are major factors.
 
Re: From small second stage to main stage?

Are you talking rock concert levels for 1,000 people, or covering a few hundred people that actually want to hear it, and the rest are just in the area?

There's a few options, and none of them are cheap for that size crowd.

Again, the JBL SRX comes up- You can get used rigs for reasonable prices, and 2 SRX725's over 2-3 SRX728's per side would be pretty good for like 600 people outside. You can stretch it so 1,000 could "hear" it, but I wouldn't be trying to pass that rig off to nationals. And, as Silas mentions, you'll need more than just speakers to cover this size crowd. Proper amp power, cabling packages, mics, monitors, A/C power, ect.


To "do it right," I'd suggest something like an EAW KF650/850 rig. 2 KF650s or 850s per side over 3-4 SB1000's per side would get the job done for sure. But, they're big and heavy boxes. They also need a lot of power to do it right. Like racks of amps and distros. They'd be over kill for smaller gigs too. I'm also a big fan of the EV x-array boxes, but they're heavy too.

I'd never suggest a line array, especially smaller ones. A pair of "old school" trap boxes is going to be much better than 3-4 small LA boxes stacked per side.

But, then comes the next question- are you trying to meet riders? Or, is this just for local cover bands? Also, do you really NEED a larger rig? Can you get enough gigs to justify spending the $$ on gear? Or, would it make more sense to own a medium sized system and rent for those few shows where you need more horse power. The latter is what I do.


From a BE prospective, If I was coming in to mix a festival for 1,000 people, I'd like to see the following(minimum):

(4-6) d&b C4 (top and sub) (or EAW KF850)
(8) d&b B2 (or 12 EAW SB1000)
d&b amps (or Crown MA power or better)
Yamaha M7CL @ FOH and MONs or better
12x2" biamped wedges

And thats the min. For gigs like this, I prefer to have 6 mid-sized LA boxes flown per side, but I'm cool with enough ground stacked power too.



Evan
 
Re: From small second stage to main stage?

Lots of good info for me to look at so far, thanks!

I'll clarify some things by saying I am experienced in running systems with larger systems and consoles such as the Allen and Heath i-Live but not so experienced in putting together full systems the standard and proper ways. The type of festivals I would be interested in probably would run 200 people or so at the stage and then others walking around. So not a 1000 seat booked event, it would be more the weekend church festivals or community festivals on smaller stages with around 1000 in attendance listening while walking around.

My console is another thing I'm going to be upgrading as well, I just want to make sure I have whats needed available for some of the larger than bar type local events in terms of coverage and volume, understanding that it's more than just speakers needed. The rest for small events I have mostly covered in a 24 channel 100 foot snake, mics, cables, lights, etc. Typical small event gear, although in the past it did all run a 400 person 3 day music festival with satisfactory but not outstanding results.

I see mentioned the SRX model JBL as an option for these types of event, or maybe even doubling up a few PRX models like I currently have in the 615's for the tops. In doing some research, it seems like these would be hard to pair side by side as their pattern is about 90 degrees. Would this not lead to some pretty harsh comb filtering or having to splay them really far away of an angle? Would something such as a DBX driverack or other processor help in this if i'm going to be going the route of doubling up per side some smaller/lower end speakers?

I know these are newbie questions to those which more more experience, but I'm hoping to take myself from knowing what I want to hear in getting a good mix and having to play with it until my ear is happy to being able to do it consistently and correctly every time. Step one is to pick the brains of those who are more there than I!
 
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