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<blockquote data-quote="TJ Cornish" data-source="post: 35590" data-attributes="member: 162">Re: Gibson raidedCharlie - I&#039;m glad you agree that it&#039;s their money.The wealthiest folks take good advantage of tax laws to keep as much of their money as possible, just as you and I do.&nbsp; Defining what they are &quot;supposed to&quot; pay is open to interpretation, class warfare, etc.&nbsp; You are implying that&#039;s unethical or immoral.&nbsp; I don&#039;t see any difference compared to any other class of people trying to minimize their tax bill by taking deductions, using investment tools like 401Ks, government bonds, etc.&nbsp; Even with all of this sheltering/&quot;cheating&quot;, the top earners pay a huge share of the tax burden.There are a lot of people who believe that the &quot;rich&quot; people pay less taxes than &quot;less rich&quot; (but still rich in a lot of people&#039;s minds) people.&nbsp; That may be true on the margin, but I would like to see documentation to this fact.&nbsp; In my experience that&#039;s rhetoric, as the vast majority of tax shelters are not greater than 100% effective - meaning that there are ways to shelter some money from certain kinds of taxation, but they don&#039;t magically make rich people immune from tax bills by hiding money outside that particular shelter.I have a personal connection to a prominent person currently in jail in MN for tax evasion who tried to operate as you suggest and pay little or no income taxes.&nbsp; The Gov&#039;t won in the end.I agree with you in your conclusion to simplify the tax code.&nbsp; Transparency is almost always good.&nbsp; Drive the costs of benefits to the users of those benefits and suddenly we&#039;ll all be able to make the choices as to what is worthwhile.&nbsp; Make car drivers pay for road improvements (gas taxes, licensing, etc.), make the ticket holders pay the bills for the big stadiums (a personal sore spot with a proposed $300m county tax levy in the county I live in for a stadium we don&#039;t need and I won&#039;t use), make park users pay for parks, etc.&nbsp; I&#039;m not opposed to some &quot;common good&quot; items - basic welfare, public education, the military (though I think we could do with a lot less spending in all 3 of those areas), but we can&#039;t afford what we have now.The local air waves are filled with ads promoting Sioux Falls, SD as a better place to live and work with fewer taxes.&nbsp; They have been successful in drawing some business away from the more expensive and more heavily taxed MPLS/STP metro that I live and work in.&nbsp; The government needs to start competing too - both with other states and cities domestically, and with other countries, as unless we close down the borders and prevent people from moving, that money and productivity will roll down hill to the place with the best value.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="TJ Cornish, post: 35590, member: 162"] Re: Gibson raided Charlie - I'm glad you agree that it's their money. The wealthiest folks take good advantage of tax laws to keep as much of [u]their[/u] money as possible, just as you and I do. Defining what they are "supposed to" pay is open to interpretation, class warfare, etc. You are implying that's unethical or immoral. I don't see any difference compared to any other class of people trying to minimize their tax bill by taking deductions, using investment tools like 401Ks, government bonds, etc. Even with all of this sheltering/"cheating", the top earners pay a huge share of the tax burden. There are a lot of people who believe that the "rich" people pay less taxes than "less rich" (but still rich in a lot of people's minds) people. That may be true on the margin, but I would like to see documentation to this fact. In my experience that's rhetoric, as the vast majority of tax shelters are not greater than 100% effective - meaning that there are ways to shelter some money from certain kinds of taxation, but they don't magically make rich people immune from tax bills by hiding money outside that particular shelter. I have a personal connection to a prominent person currently in jail in MN for tax evasion who tried to operate as you suggest and pay little or no income taxes. The Gov't won in the end. I agree with you in your conclusion to simplify the tax code. Transparency is almost always good. Drive the costs of benefits to the users of those benefits and suddenly we'll all be able to make the choices as to what is worthwhile. Make car drivers pay for road improvements (gas taxes, licensing, etc.), make the ticket holders pay the bills for the big stadiums (a personal sore spot with a proposed $300m county tax levy in the county I live in for a stadium we don't need and I won't use), make park users pay for parks, etc. I'm not opposed to some "common good" items - basic welfare, public education, the military (though I think we could do with a lot less spending in all 3 of those areas), but we can't afford what we have now. The local air waves are filled with ads promoting Sioux Falls, SD as a better place to live and work with fewer taxes. They have been successful in drawing some business away from the more expensive and more heavily taxed MPLS/STP metro that I live and work in. The government needs to start competing too - both with other states and cities domestically, and with other countries, as unless we close down the borders and prevent people from moving, that money and productivity will roll down hill to the place with the best value. [/QUOTE]

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