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New DIY Mid High (90deg) - AKA PM90
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<blockquote data-quote="Peter Morris" data-source="post: 133813" data-attributes="member: 652"><p>Re: New DIY Mid High</p><p></p><p>Hi Art,</p><p></p><p> I have to agree that the DH1A is still an excellent driver. It was one of my favourites and I used it almost exclusively in my systems 20 years ago. As much as I love the old DH1A the 4594HE is definitely worth the extra money.</p><p> The BMS drivers you tested and compared to the DH1A were standard format 1" drivers with 1.75" polyester diaphragm, not the 4594HE. I’m not sure your implied conclusions based on those tests are that valid in respect to the 4594HE.</p><p></p><p> With respect to summation I said:</p><p></p><p><em>"Being a two way driver, on a single frequency sine wave test there is no significant advantage compared to a normal driver, but on a complex wave form there is a big advantage. Being able to coherently sum the outputs you can achieve much higher peak SPL’s. You can also design the VHF to be much more efficient, in this case something like 10 - 12dB at 10kHz compared to a DH1A."</em></p><p><em></em></p><p> The output of any speaker is the sum of the acoustic output of the drivers it uses. For example I posted a picture of 400Hz square wave. Without going into the math, you could say that it is actually made up of a collection of sine waves. 400Hz + 1200 + 2000 + 2800 + …… 6000 +6800 + 7600 + 8400 etc. (Fourier series for a square wave <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Square_wave" target="_blank"><u><span style="color: #0000ff">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Square_wave</span></u></a>)</p><p> In this case the 12" drivers are only producing a 400 Hz wave; the low section of the 4594 is producing 1200Hz + 2000 …. 6000, and the HF, 6800Hz + 7600 + 8400 etc. All of these bits add together to form a square wave. i.e. "the acoustic output is the sum of a 150 watt HF and an 80 watt VHF driver" … and the 12"</p><p></p><p> As part of a simple explanation, if we look at another example and compare a 2 way speaker with a 3 way speaker (with all the comparative components being equal) using a single tone the maximum SPL is the same for both speakers (power in multiplied by efficiency). If we use broad band noise or music it a different story, the energy is shared over 3 drivers instead of 2. If we assume the drivers are all 100 watt each and the crossovers frequencies are selected so that the load is shared equally, then the 2 way speaker can take 200 watts of energy and the 3 way, 300 watts. Assuming perfect summation the 300 watt speaker will be louder. </p><p></p><p> That’s exactly what happening in this case.</p><p></p><p> With regards to the VHF output, the plots you posted show the DH1A’s efficiency with a 5 watt input being about 105 dB on a 90 x 40 horn … or roughly 100 dB 1 W/ 1m. In comparison the VHF section of the 4594HE makes about 112 dB 1w / 1m on a similar horn and is rated for a similar input.</p><p></p><p> This is what 3 x 4594 per side will do when they are summed correctly on a good horn - <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkrZplo9xgM" target="_blank"><u><span style="color: #0000ff">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkrZplo9xgM</span></u></a></p><p><a href="http://www.danleysoundlabs.com/danley/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/JH90-spec-sheet.pdf" target="_blank"><u><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.danleysoundlabs.com/danley/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/JH90-spec-sheet.pdf</span></u></a></p><p> There are also some videos of a SH96H0 in action somewhere (?) that are very impressive that use 1 x 4594. </p><p></p><p> It’s also interesting note the difference between Danley’s standard SH96 and the high output, HO version which the only difference is a more powerful compression driver. (I believe a Faital Pro HF14T (?) V’S a BMS 4594)</p><p> You also mention JBL new D2 with the dual diaphragms. This idea was originally patented by (can’t remember his name) from BMS. JBL uses the duel diaphragms in a very similar arrange but I believe there in no legal infringement of the patent. Recently BMS in accordance with the original patent released this driver, arguably "the loudest audio transducer ever made". <a href="http://www.bmsspeakers.com/fileadmin/bms-data/product_data_2014/bms_4599nd_preliminary.pdf" target="_blank"><u><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.bmsspeakers.com/fileadmin/bms-data/product_data_2014/bms_4599nd_preliminary.pdf</span></u></a></p><p></p><p> Anyway as I said before … you need to try the 4594HE <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" />~<img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" />~:smile:</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Peter Morris, post: 133813, member: 652"] Re: New DIY Mid High Hi Art, I have to agree that the DH1A is still an excellent driver. It was one of my favourites and I used it almost exclusively in my systems 20 years ago. As much as I love the old DH1A the 4594HE is definitely worth the extra money. The BMS drivers you tested and compared to the DH1A were standard format 1" drivers with 1.75" polyester diaphragm, not the 4594HE. I’m not sure your implied conclusions based on those tests are that valid in respect to the 4594HE. With respect to summation I said: [I]"Being a two way driver, on a single frequency sine wave test there is no significant advantage compared to a normal driver, but on a complex wave form there is a big advantage. Being able to coherently sum the outputs you can achieve much higher peak SPL’s. You can also design the VHF to be much more efficient, in this case something like 10 - 12dB at 10kHz compared to a DH1A." [/I] The output of any speaker is the sum of the acoustic output of the drivers it uses. For example I posted a picture of 400Hz square wave. Without going into the math, you could say that it is actually made up of a collection of sine waves. 400Hz + 1200 + 2000 + 2800 + …… 6000 +6800 + 7600 + 8400 etc. (Fourier series for a square wave [URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Square_wave"][U][COLOR=#0000ff]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Square_wave[/COLOR][/U][/URL]) In this case the 12" drivers are only producing a 400 Hz wave; the low section of the 4594 is producing 1200Hz + 2000 …. 6000, and the HF, 6800Hz + 7600 + 8400 etc. All of these bits add together to form a square wave. i.e. "the acoustic output is the sum of a 150 watt HF and an 80 watt VHF driver" … and the 12" As part of a simple explanation, if we look at another example and compare a 2 way speaker with a 3 way speaker (with all the comparative components being equal) using a single tone the maximum SPL is the same for both speakers (power in multiplied by efficiency). If we use broad band noise or music it a different story, the energy is shared over 3 drivers instead of 2. If we assume the drivers are all 100 watt each and the crossovers frequencies are selected so that the load is shared equally, then the 2 way speaker can take 200 watts of energy and the 3 way, 300 watts. Assuming perfect summation the 300 watt speaker will be louder. That’s exactly what happening in this case. With regards to the VHF output, the plots you posted show the DH1A’s efficiency with a 5 watt input being about 105 dB on a 90 x 40 horn … or roughly 100 dB 1 W/ 1m. In comparison the VHF section of the 4594HE makes about 112 dB 1w / 1m on a similar horn and is rated for a similar input. This is what 3 x 4594 per side will do when they are summed correctly on a good horn - [URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkrZplo9xgM"][U][COLOR=#0000ff]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkrZplo9xgM[/COLOR][/U][/URL] [URL="http://www.danleysoundlabs.com/danley/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/JH90-spec-sheet.pdf"][U][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.danleysoundlabs.com/danley/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/JH90-spec-sheet.pdf[/COLOR][/U][/URL] There are also some videos of a SH96H0 in action somewhere (?) that are very impressive that use 1 x 4594. It’s also interesting note the difference between Danley’s standard SH96 and the high output, HO version which the only difference is a more powerful compression driver. (I believe a Faital Pro HF14T (?) V’S a BMS 4594) You also mention JBL new D2 with the dual diaphragms. This idea was originally patented by (can’t remember his name) from BMS. JBL uses the duel diaphragms in a very similar arrange but I believe there in no legal infringement of the patent. Recently BMS in accordance with the original patent released this driver, arguably "the loudest audio transducer ever made". [URL="http://www.bmsspeakers.com/fileadmin/bms-data/product_data_2014/bms_4599nd_preliminary.pdf"][U][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.bmsspeakers.com/fileadmin/bms-data/product_data_2014/bms_4599nd_preliminary.pdf[/COLOR][/U][/URL] Anyway as I said before … you need to try the 4594HE :)~:-)~:smile: [/QUOTE]
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