What does one do without prediction software?

Max Warasila

Max Warasila

Graduate
Feb 20, 2013
1,217
73
48
Richmond, VA
Okay, so let's say we have a line array that lacks a compatible prediction software/gll files or something we already have that is approved by the vendor or the line array. I know of many smaller name brands out there who- while we don't usually encounter them- don't have prediction software, but sound relatively good regardless of that lack of functionality. I would hate to have to write them off because I simply don't have the mental capacity nor the skill to do all of the math involved by hand, so is there any way to perhaps create an alternative solution to this problem?

I know- just don't buy them. I agree completely. But just in the event that one does have to deal with this, what would one do?
 
Re: What does one do without prediction software?

Max Warasila said:
I know- just don't buy them. I agree completely. But just in the event that one does have to deal with this, what would one do?
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Run away, for the rigging/safety reasons Ryan mentions.

And if you insist on using these budget systems you'll need to become proficient in making acoustic measurements of line arrays in situ.

How anyone could spend money on a speaker system and have no idea if it would actually cover their venues is silly... no, make that just plain stupid. My boss would fire me if I spent $20,000 on a rig that has no way to do aiming and SPL predictions.
 
Re: What does one do without prediction software?

As Ryan stated, the safety and rigging issues come first, but as far as the sound it seems to pretty much become trial and error with no real way to predict the results in advance other than to mock up the scenario and adjust and measure until you get an acceptable result. After doing that nultiple times for a particular product you may start to get a sense of how it behaves as an array but you'd probably still want to verify it.

One of the major potential advantages of a line array is being able to be configured and adjusted to fit an application and venue, but because of how line arrays work the resulting performance of the array represents a much more complex interaction than for a typical two or three splayed box array. Companies who don't offer any array prediction software for their line arrays seem to either a) think typical users of those products are not capable of properly applying such software and prefer to have them tell you what to do, b) do not understand the practical applications of line arrays or c) are perhaps more interested in selling products rather than offering solutions.
 
Re: What does one do without prediction software?

Tim McCulloch said:
Run away, for the rigging/safety reasons Ryan mentions.

And if you insist on using these budget systems you'll need to become proficient in making acoustic measurements of line arrays in situ.

How anyone could spend money on a speaker system and have no idea if it would actually cover their venues is silly... no, make that just plain stupid. My boss would fire me if I spent $20,000 on a rig that has no way to do aiming and SPL predictions.
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I have a hard time thinking of any box that the designers do not have data on how they interact as an "array".

Now that that is taken care of, maybe you guys can help me with a side project.

I was at a car dealership and happened to see a new Chevy SS, the same model they use for NASCAR, and I decided I would like to get into NASCAR racing. My budget was a little tight so instead of an SS I made a down payment on a Chevy Sonic (after all its the same brand and looks similar).

Now I have some specific questions I think you guys can help me with:

Tim, I think I might have been given an owners manual but I haven't had a chance to dig through the glove box yet, so could you tell me what all the switches and lights on the dashboard are for.

Brad, I know I may have to make some modifications for racing, but since I can only afford one car at once and this also has to be my daily driver, do you think a paint job with a number and some stickers would be adequate?

Max, you live pretty close to me. How would you like to come be part of my race crew? I can't pay you or provide insurance, but it should be a good learning experience for you if you ever want to start your own race team.
 
Re: What does one do without prediction software?

When you say "sound relatively good"-what exactly does that mean?

Does that mean they provide even coverage from front to back-with the same tonality? Or just at one location? What about all the rest of the seats?

And what is the "frame of reference". If you have a poor frame of reference-then there are a whole bunch of products that sound "good".

But when you expect more-that frame of reference goes up-and you have to move to better products.

McDonalds makes a pretty good hamburger-for some people, and it is "just fine". But if you want a real good hamburger-you are going to have to spend more money.

It depends on how easily "satisfied" you are.
 
Re: What does one do without prediction software?

I have the strange feeling that this became the "Satire Hour" for some reason.

In all seriousness, I don't have any intention of purchasing this crap. It was purely if I was ever shoved a system such as that and had no choice. I believe the consensus is to A) run away from and remove any rigged boxes B) fire the person who purchased them, and C) quit the gig, then return to using actual technology. Good. I like that answer. Thank you very much for the check.

In response to Jay: I'd love to! I like a good laugh, and you're not charging me at all.
 
Re: What does one do without prediction software?

With EASE Focus available to our industry, there is no longer an excuse for a manufacturer of an array-able loudspeaker product to not have prediction software for their products if they don't make their own software to do this. Unfortunately the bean counters and marketing folk control the money needed to make this happen, and unless they hear from us, there is little motivation for them to spend the money on this.
 
Re: What does one do without prediction software?

I was just looking at RCF's prediction software for their NX series boxes. Buggy and not well refined at all. I guess it's better than nothing, but they really need to work on it.
 
Re: What does one do without prediction software?

Greg Cameron said:
I was just looking at RCF's prediction software for their NX series boxes. Buggy and not well refined at all. I guess it's better than nothing, but they really need to work on it.
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I don't think it's just buggy, the answers it gives are implausible. This was the biggest reason I didn't buy them.
 
Re: What does one do without prediction software?

Greg Cameron said:
I was just looking at RCF's prediction software for their NX series boxes. Buggy and not well refined at all. I guess it's better than nothing, but they really need to work on it.
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We use EASE Focus II for the RCF line arrays. It's vastly better than the NXL/HDL software, and much better than the TTL software.
 
Re: What does one do without prediction software?

Caleb Dick said:
We use EASE Focus II for the RCF line arrays. It's vastly better than the NXL/HDL software, and much better than the TTL software.
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Caleb, do you have the EASE II .gll file for the RCF NX-L23A? Looks like RCF only has the older EASE data...

Thanks,
Greg
 
Re: What does one do without prediction software?

Max Warasila said:
I have the strange feeling that this became the "Satire Hour" for some reason.

In all seriousness, I don't have any intention of purchasing this crap. It was purely if I was ever shoved a system such as that and had no choice. I believe the consensus is to A) run away from and remove any rigged boxes B) fire the person who purchased them, and C) quit the gig, then return to using actual technology. Good. I like that answer. Thank you very much for the check.

In response to Jay: I'd love to! I like a good laugh, and you're not charging me at all.
Click to expand...

I should have put a smiley in my post, I guess. Too late to edit it in....

However I wasn't joking when I said that my boss would probably fire me if I spent $20 Large on a "system" that lacked the tools needed to use it safely and effectively. Should the flybar support the weight if lifted from *arbitrary* point? Who knows? How will changing a couple of box angles move the center of gravity? Again, who knows? Will changes overload a rigging point? Coverage is important, too, but at least it won't kill anyone...

I'd extend your response A to add "...remove any rigged boxes and set fire to them in conjunction with B) following... for good measure, throw the purchaser on the fire, too. ;), :D, 8)~8-)~:cool: nudge, wink, etc.
 
Re: What does one do without prediction software?

Tim McCulloch said:
I should have put a smiley in my post, I guess. Too late to edit it in....

However I wasn't joking when I said that my boss would probably fire me if I spent $20 Large on a "system" that lacked the tools needed to use it safely and effectively. Should the flybar support the weight if lifted from *arbitrary* point? Who knows? How will changing a couple of box angles move the center of gravity? Again, who knows? Will changes overload a rigging point? Coverage is important, too, but at least it won't kill anyone...

I'd extend your response A to add "...remove any rigged boxes and set fire to them in conjunction with B) following... for good measure, throw the purchaser on the fire, too. ;), :D, 8)~8-)~:cool: nudge, wink, etc.
Click to expand...

Nawww don't set fire to the cabinets! deconstruct them and sell them as "professional" car audio supplements :D
 
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