Looking for some real world advice from those who have used either digital platform of the soundcraft vi series or Midas pro2 desks. Anyone out there have any pros or cons from the desks?
Thanks!
Jon
Thanks!
Jon
Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
- Thread starter Jon Hoffmann
- Start date
Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
Jon,
Depending on your use case it is very hard to make a concrete list of pros or cons.
One thing, personally, that I like about the Pro2 is the separation between the "pop" group functionality and the VCA style functionality. For how I like to set up VCAs, this is very useful. For instance the VCA could be "Rhythm" and include bass, congas, rhythm guitar, tambourine, etc. The pop ground could be just drums.
Another thing I like about the Pro2 is pretty smart choices for what features have physical buttons on the console. I've never been around a Vi1, so I can't compare them.
PS no Midas fanboyism here, if anything I've been critical of their product.
That's one relatively meaningless datapoint, depending on your use case.
Jon,
Depending on your use case it is very hard to make a concrete list of pros or cons.
One thing, personally, that I like about the Pro2 is the separation between the "pop" group functionality and the VCA style functionality. For how I like to set up VCAs, this is very useful. For instance the VCA could be "Rhythm" and include bass, congas, rhythm guitar, tambourine, etc. The pop ground could be just drums.
Another thing I like about the Pro2 is pretty smart choices for what features have physical buttons on the console. I've never been around a Vi1, so I can't compare them.
PS no Midas fanboyism here, if anything I've been critical of their product.
That's one relatively meaningless datapoint, depending on your use case.
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Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
Pro 2 hands down. There is no comparison. If you like the sound of an XL4, you'll love the Pro 2.
Evan
Pro 2 hands down. There is no comparison. If you like the sound of an XL4, you'll love the Pro 2.
Evan
Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
I guess if you need or want the Midas effect then the Pro2 wins but with my admittedly limited use/trying out the Pro2 I actually find the aux and Eq controls in partcular awkward, my eyesight is poor particularly on the right also I have toes for fingers so having the controls closely spaced and also the same knob doing different things ie the eq is like a LS9 in that you select a band then adjust using the 3 or 4 knobs, I've never got on with this and I've seen others make mistakes especially in a hurry or when distracted. The Vi1 has IMO the best iteration of the Vi interface it is bright and clear plus its easier to see at a glance whats happening where than theMidas's quite crowded screen. As far as sound is concerned I suspect that what is connected into and what the console in turn is connected to will make a bigger difference than any diffence in the console's "sound" The Vi makes an excellent monitor console as well in fact I think that is it's big selling point as the layout lends itself to mixing multiple outs.
Of course familiarity with the Midas will overcome some of this and not everyone is as ham fisted as me but I still think the Vi is easier to use for walk up engineers with little experience of digital, however as the Midas consoles sell then more people will have show files and I've no doubt that they will be come as ubiquitous as the Heritage and Veronas were which I have to say I also had issues with seeing the markings on the surface - Verona and some of the small controls, auxes and Q especially on the Heritage. I guess that was a long winded way of saying if it's for rental the Midas if it's for yoursef then consider the Vi
I guess if you need or want the Midas effect then the Pro2 wins but with my admittedly limited use/trying out the Pro2 I actually find the aux and Eq controls in partcular awkward, my eyesight is poor particularly on the right also I have toes for fingers so having the controls closely spaced and also the same knob doing different things ie the eq is like a LS9 in that you select a band then adjust using the 3 or 4 knobs, I've never got on with this and I've seen others make mistakes especially in a hurry or when distracted. The Vi1 has IMO the best iteration of the Vi interface it is bright and clear plus its easier to see at a glance whats happening where than theMidas's quite crowded screen. As far as sound is concerned I suspect that what is connected into and what the console in turn is connected to will make a bigger difference than any diffence in the console's "sound" The Vi makes an excellent monitor console as well in fact I think that is it's big selling point as the layout lends itself to mixing multiple outs.
Of course familiarity with the Midas will overcome some of this and not everyone is as ham fisted as me but I still think the Vi is easier to use for walk up engineers with little experience of digital, however as the Midas consoles sell then more people will have show files and I've no doubt that they will be come as ubiquitous as the Heritage and Veronas were which I have to say I also had issues with seeing the markings on the surface - Verona and some of the small controls, auxes and Q especially on the Heritage. I guess that was a long winded way of saying if it's for rental the Midas if it's for yoursef then consider the Vi
Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
I've mixed on both of them. Contrary to Evan's distinct opinion, I far prefer the Vi - hands down
. The Pro6 is a very nice desk, the Pro2 to a lesser extent. The Pro series do sound very similar to their analog counterparts. The Soundcraft Vi's are essentially Studer desks. Sonically, that is a very good thing. You could do much worse than either of these desks.
I've mixed on both of them. Contrary to Evan's distinct opinion, I far prefer the Vi - hands down
. The Pro6 is a very nice desk, the Pro2 to a lesser extent. The Pro series do sound very similar to their analog counterparts. The Soundcraft Vi's are essentially Studer desks. Sonically, that is a very good thing. You could do much worse than either of these desks.Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
Thanks all - We currently have a Si Compact in our space, but we are potentially moving to a larger console to accomodate larger groups (casino entertainment space), and for the price and features it looked like these two were pretty close contenders. Evan, have you used the Pro2? I know you use a Pro6 (correct?) with ATL, are there major differences in the interfaces other than the size and IO?
Thanks all - We currently have a Si Compact in our space, but we are potentially moving to a larger console to accomodate larger groups (casino entertainment space), and for the price and features it looked like these two were pretty close contenders. Evan, have you used the Pro2? I know you use a Pro6 (correct?) with ATL, are there major differences in the interfaces other than the size and IO?
If you have to meet riders, I've seen VI on many more riders than the pro series. It seems to me like that the BEs that want them are carrying them with them.
Sent from my DROID2 Global 2
Sent from my DROID2 Global 2
Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
If you have to fill riders buy an Avid Profile or Yamaha 5DRH.
If you have to fill riders buy an Avid Profile or Yamaha 5DRH.
Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
I've actually had the Pro 2 out with me all summer, and I love it. This desk is going to take off very soon. Especially for the price and the market it's aimed toward. There is no sound quality difference between any of the Pro series desks(that includes the Pro 1). They all use the exact same preamp stage box, and they are all networkable together. I spent a day with the Midas guys. They did a shootout of the Pro series vs the XL4, and nobody could tell a difference, all the way down the chain.
I'm sold on the desks. They sound fantastic, and are a pleasure to mix on. I bounce between an SC48 and Pro 2 daily mixing 2 different bands. I enjoy the workflow of the SC48, but the Pro 2 takes the cake. The surface isn't cluttered, and you can get to anything you need in a matter of a push of a button or tap of a knob. I do not find myself missing the extra bells and whistles of the Pro 6 when working on the Pro 2. And really, the only differences are physical. From a software standpoint, the desks are the exact same. The built in effects sound superb, and they keep adding new toys with each update. The built in comps are great- my personal favorite is the vintage comp. The EQ is super responsive and actually sounds like it looks. I find myself doing weird things on the SC48/d-show to make it sound right- not the case with the Pro series.
Also, between the 6 POP groups, and 8 VCA's, you can get to any channel you need very quickly. And, with the color coding system, you really don't have to read anymore. The screen is also VERY visible in daylight, and it looks great!
The learning curve is a little different on the Pro series, mainly because there's nothing else like it. They went an entirely different route with their stuff, and I like it, a lot. The patching always seems to confuse people at first, but once you wrap your head around it, you realize just how unlimited your options are with this desk.
Oh, and don't forget the networking capabilities! 1 stage box can be used for as many desks as you need. Yeah, you have to do stage box gain sharing, but you can still adjust the digital trim at the desk end as needed. You can patch audio from desk to desk easily. It's really cool!
I've mixed on the Soundcraft desks many times, and have always been left cold. The compressors don't do it for me(no adjustable knee), and the effects leave me wanting more. It's not a bad desk by any means, but the Pro 2 just blows it away IMO.
Evan
I've actually had the Pro 2 out with me all summer, and I love it. This desk is going to take off very soon. Especially for the price and the market it's aimed toward. There is no sound quality difference between any of the Pro series desks(that includes the Pro 1). They all use the exact same preamp stage box, and they are all networkable together. I spent a day with the Midas guys. They did a shootout of the Pro series vs the XL4, and nobody could tell a difference, all the way down the chain.
I'm sold on the desks. They sound fantastic, and are a pleasure to mix on. I bounce between an SC48 and Pro 2 daily mixing 2 different bands. I enjoy the workflow of the SC48, but the Pro 2 takes the cake. The surface isn't cluttered, and you can get to anything you need in a matter of a push of a button or tap of a knob. I do not find myself missing the extra bells and whistles of the Pro 6 when working on the Pro 2. And really, the only differences are physical. From a software standpoint, the desks are the exact same. The built in effects sound superb, and they keep adding new toys with each update. The built in comps are great- my personal favorite is the vintage comp. The EQ is super responsive and actually sounds like it looks. I find myself doing weird things on the SC48/d-show to make it sound right- not the case with the Pro series.
Also, between the 6 POP groups, and 8 VCA's, you can get to any channel you need very quickly. And, with the color coding system, you really don't have to read anymore. The screen is also VERY visible in daylight, and it looks great!
The learning curve is a little different on the Pro series, mainly because there's nothing else like it. They went an entirely different route with their stuff, and I like it, a lot. The patching always seems to confuse people at first, but once you wrap your head around it, you realize just how unlimited your options are with this desk.
Oh, and don't forget the networking capabilities! 1 stage box can be used for as many desks as you need. Yeah, you have to do stage box gain sharing, but you can still adjust the digital trim at the desk end as needed. You can patch audio from desk to desk easily. It's really cool!
I've mixed on the Soundcraft desks many times, and have always been left cold. The compressors don't do it for me(no adjustable knee), and the effects leave me wanting more. It's not a bad desk by any means, but the Pro 2 just blows it away IMO.
Evan
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Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
The pic from the mix position... you now work standing on your head?
The pic from the mix position... you now work standing on your head?
Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
Maybe he was touring in the southern hemisphere?
JR
Maybe he was touring in the southern hemisphere?
JR
Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
You know, on my laptop I can just tip it upside down and view the pic but on my mobile I can't get it to work without tipping myself upside down. What are the southern hemisphere folks doing when we post pics the "other" way?
You know, on my laptop I can just tip it upside down and view the pic but on my mobile I can't get it to work without tipping myself upside down. What are the southern hemisphere folks doing when we post pics the "other" way?
Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
I've mixed a handful of shows on the Vi and toured with both the Pro2 and the Studer Vista 5SR. While the Soundcraft has the option of Studer preamps and benefits from some technology they created, it is not a Studer desk. The sonic differences between the Vista and the Vi are quite apparent and after spending time on the Studer, I grew to like the Vi less. On the other hand, according to the Midas product manager I was working with on the last tour, the Midas digital consoles all boast the same DSP and Preamps (although there are slight modifications to preamp gain steps) throughout the product line. Sonic quality was so impressive on the Pro2, I started to look past its ergonomic deficiencies.
I'd choose the Midas, but like others have mentioned, in both cases you're dealing with good products.
I've mixed on both of them. Contrary to Evan's distinct opinion, I far prefer the Vi - hands down
I've mixed a handful of shows on the Vi and toured with both the Pro2 and the Studer Vista 5SR. While the Soundcraft has the option of Studer preamps and benefits from some technology they created, it is not a Studer desk. The sonic differences between the Vista and the Vi are quite apparent and after spending time on the Studer, I grew to like the Vi less. On the other hand, according to the Midas product manager I was working with on the last tour, the Midas digital consoles all boast the same DSP and Preamps (although there are slight modifications to preamp gain steps) throughout the product line. Sonic quality was so impressive on the Pro2, I started to look past its ergonomic deficiencies.
I'd choose the Midas, but like others have mentioned, in both cases you're dealing with good products.
Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
It seems as if technology has gotten the best of me this time around. :lol:
Evan
It seems as if technology has gotten the best of me this time around. :lol:
Evan
Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
Thanks for real user review. I see you are using Pro 2. We are considering Pro 2 vs 2c. From your experience, how useful is to have another 8 faders, workflow-wise, or you can get away with using "extend" to VCA faders, or using pop groups? In other words, would it worth spending more for Pro 2? We are doing mostly local bands, 32 inputs max with 10-12 more of Pro Tools playback.
Thanks for real user review. I see you are using Pro 2. We are considering Pro 2 vs 2c. From your experience, how useful is to have another 8 faders, workflow-wise, or you can get away with using "extend" to VCA faders, or using pop groups? In other words, would it worth spending more for Pro 2? We are doing mostly local bands, 32 inputs max with 10-12 more of Pro Tools playback.
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Re: Console comparison vi1 vs Midas pro2
What you spend stepping up to the 2 surface from the 2C surface might be saved by using the DL150 series boxes instead of the DL251. One can hope, at least.
What you spend stepping up to the 2 surface from the 2C surface might be saved by using the DL150 series boxes instead of the DL251. One can hope, at least.
A DL251 MAPs a bit over $4k, while three DL15x boxes MAP at $4500. You gain modularity and a few I/O, lose redundancy, for a few dollars more.
2 vs 2c - personal preference. They have the same capabilities. A 2c has the functionality of a 2, at nearly the price of a Pro1. I use and train others on both, to me they are interchangeable other than cost.