Favorite mid-range powered speaker

Re: Favorite mid-range powered speaker

Jim McKeveny said:
Should we always assume that anything with FIR is inherently better than IIR, particularly in the audio range?
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No. FIR is not without its drawbacks (increased latency in particular), and a well designed loudspeaker system with IIR filters will outperform a poorly designed system with FIR processing. FIR processing is simply another tool inthe designer's toolbox.
 
Re: Favorite mid-range powered speaker

We ended up going with the EV ETX cabinets. Again this is for rental needs and was looking for something better that the plastic powered speakers out there. The ETX18SP was actually the best sub of the bunch and the EV ETX 12P was the best choice to match up with that sub. We weren't completely sold with it but none of the tops were that great. We ended up putting the EV top in "Music" mode instead of live and that sounded slightly better and helped make the choice easier. The JBL SRX812P sounded similar to the EV but with a little more harshness in the midrange. The JBL SRX818 sub had a very aggresive limiter that kicked in early and held for longer than it should. We also looked at some Presonus AI live cabinets, the high end was the nicest of the bunch but also seemed to be light in this area compared to EV ETX, JBL SRX800, Yamaha DXR and Nexo PS10-R2(reference). It also seemed to step back as far as imaging where as the other cabs all seemed to be right in front of you.

As far as FIR filter - the increased latency isn't necessarily a bad thing especially if it is being used for mains. If used for monitors this can cause a issue, however most of these cabs have a monitor mode which should reduce any issues/concerns in this area.

db
 
Re: Favorite mid-range powered speaker

Not questioning your purchase decision at all... and I hear ya on the more foward mid sound you talk about...I just wanted to mention a time I heard a presonus demo (thanks Tim!) - one of the AI live boxes we tried out sounded quite different from the others, it had a little less forward high mid sound, after a quick firmware update, -issue fixed!
 
Re: Favorite mid-range powered speaker

I just got back from a listening session where we compared a QSC KW122, QSC K12, and a SRX815P.

Some thoughts - They sound significantly different than each other. The KW122 sounded more "scooped", the SRX815P sounded a little more upper mid-rangey. I was wishing for a little bit more sparkle from the SRX815P than what was in the standard "Mains" preset.

We put the KW122 and 815P on the floor in monitor mode. Gain before feedback was very similar, and with an SM58 rang first somewhere around 400-500Hz on both boxes. The SRX815 sounded a fair bit better overall than the KW and K series.

The box is very nicely made. The handles are rubberized, the pole socket has two positions, 0° and -7.5° (I think - there isn't actually a spec for this, but I think that's pretty standard.) It feels like an SRX or Vertec box as to how its made.

I have a couple things I would like to see changed: - It's a fairly big box, about an inch larger in all three dimensions compared to the EV ETX (comparing spec sheets - I haven't been able to hear or see the ETX yet). Also, the on-panel DSP controls don't allow any EQ or delay settings like the ETX series do - you have to use the software control for everything but level control and preset selection.

Those aren't huge issues though, and it isn't a difficult choice between the three boxes we had to test - the SRX815 is a much more modern sounding box.

I'm hoping to be able to repeat some of Dan's listening comparison between an ETX and SRX if I can get both boxes together at the same time.
 
Re: Favorite mid-range powered speaker

I'm facing that exact choice now, I need two 15'' top cabs to use without subs, almost every weekend I'm renting some to fill in the gap, and I'm almost going nuts trying to decide the best option:

- Get 2 RCF 745A, as they seem to be the best all-rounder, but still a bit expensive,
- 2 FBT PromaXx 14a, nice sound, ugly looking,
- Wait for SRX815P to show up in the local distributor as it seems like a potential standard,
- Make 2 custom passive boxes ( like B&C suggested designs ) with XTI powering, cheap and flexible option, but time-consuming and not 100% guarantee,
- DSR, ETX, other options etc


Any opinions on the rcf 745a ( my top choice atm ) vs the others?
 
Re: Favorite mid-range powered speaker

Dan Brown said:
As far as FIR filter - the increased latency isn't necessarily a bad thing especially if it is being used for mains. If used for monitors this can cause a issue, however most of these cabs have a monitor mode which should reduce any issues/concerns in this area.

db
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I would imagine Monitor Mode is about signal shaping, not latency.

Keep in mind that cumulative latency may soon become an issue: Imagine a signal flow of a digital wireless mic, into a digital console, monitored by digital IEM.
 
Re: Favorite mid-range powered speaker

Jim McKeveny said:
I would imagine Monitor Mode is about signal shaping, not latency.

Keep in mind that cumulative latency may soon become an issue: Imagine a signal flow of a digital wireless mic, into a digital console, monitored by digital IEM.
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I agree. The SRX manual is finally posted, and they list the speaker at 2ms latency (internally it processes at 96Khz). The main vs monitor presets are about the LF differences due to going from whole space to half space, and some reflection issues. Though it is not explicitly stated in the manual, I'd be shocked if they switched to IIR mode for the monitor preset to shave off 1 ms, and I'm not sure it would matter that much anyway for a wedge. IEMs may potentially be a problem due to comb-filtering in the musician's head, but I would doubt wedges would get to be an issue until total system latency is 10ms or more.
 
Re: Favorite mid-range powered speaker

TJ Cornish said:
but I would doubt wedges would get to be an issue until total system latency is 10ms or more.
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The 10ms spec is a rule of thumb, the acronym being "ROT".

Most performers do not voice an issue until we pass the 10ms ROT threshold. Some are more sensitive, especially "money" performers.

Latency should be consciously conserved - like keeping your powder dry. Low latency can be the subtle difference between "Something's not right", "Good enough", and "Great!"..
 
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