KF730/SB730/SB1000 system

H

Helge A. Bentsen

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Jan 19, 2011
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Oslo, Norway, Norway
drbentsen.no
I did a system alingment for a customer today. He was complaining about boomy subwoofers and too much mid-range "mud". His system is two flown SB730, four KF730 flown below and a single SB1000 on the floor on each side. All powered by Labgruppen amps and processed with a UX8800 for 730s and delay speakers, MX8750 on the Sb1000s.

I didn't go that much into detail in his previous tuning apart from that it had a sub xo of 100hz and overlapping xo's on SB730s and SB1000. I updated the UX to single mode firmware and resatt all xo's.
Electrical crossovers ended up like this:
KF730 HP@160Hz, LR24.
SB730 HP@80Hz, LP@125Hz, LR24.
SB1000 LP@ 60hz, LR24.


Both me and the customer thought it sounded pretty consistent with some delay and gain adjustments and a minor EQ tweak around 250 Hz. I didn't listen to his previous tuning, but the customer said that it was better after I retuned, so no problems there.

Has anybody here got done something similar with a system like this?
Is there something I should have done "different" or "better"?
It's not that often that I tune systems with a combination of flown and stacked subwoofers :)
 
Re: KF730/SB730/SB1000 system

I'd say in this and similar cases, the flown subs are really more of an additional band-pass to the tops for low mid reproduction rather than subs at all. Sound like you got it right to me.
 
Re: KF730/SB730/SB1000 system

Hi Helge:

I'll try to do a follow-up post in a while, but I'd definitely try another option for processing that setup.

In the mean time, here's a wonderful summary by the master on flown/stacked sub arrays. Must have been from the EAW forum, but I can't find the link:

FlownGndSubs.png
 
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Re: KF730/SB730/SB1000 system

Well then, what I'd really like are a couple of round trip plane tickets to Norway for a week or two to play with this rig! :)

But, since that's a tad unlikely...

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KF730_4-8_SB730_Alignment.png
Notes:

  1. The green curve is the KF730's low passband processed by the UX. If you use a 160Hz HP on it that'll be about the same as muting it.
  2. The overlap of the SB730's (blue trace) and KF730's makes a world of difference and will make anyone that hears it hesitate in their consideration of the KF740.
  3. Use the MX8750 for your delays, use the UX for your KF730's, SB730's and SB1000's.
  4. All data fields not mentioned below remain at their defaults.
  5. These suggestions assume that all amps have the same gains.
  6. Input PEQ for KF730 results in NEXO and KF740 like curves that begin to rise just before 2kHz. The Smaart plot in this post shows KF730 curve without these (5) PEQ filters. Enabling the filters makes the KF730 sound as good as it can get with the UX IMO.
  7. The HP and PEQ for the SB730 allows them to go almost 6dB louder than stock with almost no audible reduction in LF extension. The PEQ is the reciprocal of what EAW has in the greybox.
  8. You must use the KF730x4-8 greybox for these sub settings. Not only is this the best sounding KF730 greybox regardless of array size, every greybox has a different latency, thus a different delay requirement for the mating subs. In the case of the KF730, the polarity of the low and mid-high passbands are swapped relative to the KF730x16 greybox which will really screw things up if you switch between the two indiscriminately.
  9. Assuming you're dumb enough to do what I say, once you have everything setup leave the SB1000's off and get a feel for how much better the flown array sounds and what it can do without the ground stacked subs. Then slowly bring the SB1000's into the mix and see what happens. I have a strong feeling that you won't be needing as much help from the SB1000's as you used to.
  10. Run the two sub types from two independent aux channels. Send kick, bass and floor toms to the SB1000's as usual, but also send all the toms, snare, electric guitars and maybe keys to the SB730's. Even send vocals to the SB730's if it's grungy. Use the console's HP filters to limit the amount of SB730 contribution from stuff you're used to sending only to the tops. Warmth and power rule rock! Don't be lazy and boring like 99% of even the good BE's I've met! :)
  11. You should master EAW's Resolution software and make sure the flown rig really is hung as well as possible for your venue.
KF730:

Greybox: KF730x4-8 BI
HP 80Hz

Input PEQ:

  1. 85Hz, +2dB, .5 BW
  2. 580Hz, +2dB, .25 BW
  3. 1,000Hz, -2dB, .2 BW
  4. 1,300Hz, +2dB, .3 BW
  5. 3,200Hz, -3dB, .5 BW
SB730:

Greybox: SB730 SNGL
HP 35Hz BW24, LP 80Hz LR24, Delay 2.71ms, Gain -3dB

Input PEQ:

  1. 35.5Hz, -2dB, .5 BW
SB1000:

Greybox: SB1000z SNGL
HP 25Hz BW24, LP 80Hz LR24, Delay 5ms
 
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