Lavalier Mic comparison

P

Patty Verzella

Freshman
Feb 18, 2014
1
0
0
Hello!
I'm a high school theater director who knows every aspect of theater inside and out... except sound!

I'm looking to purchase wireless microphones for my theater. After weighing all my options with frequency bands and all those other things, I'm down to 2 different mics: Shure BLX14 and Samson Concert 88 Presenter.
The only hangup I have is cost. Shure seems like the industry standard, but they're twice the price of the Samsons. I know, I know, you get what you pay for. But I thought I'd ask. If we go with the Samsons, we'll have wiggle room for cabling. The Shure mics will hold up, but we'll go over budget when we start connecting them to the board!

Has anyone ever used the Samson Concert 88 series for theatrical use? The manufacturer makes a big deal about them being for "presenters" like in business meetings or seminars. Not sure how they'd hold up to a belter. However, they also have 3 other "packages": guitar, headset, and handheld. They seem like the same equipment with different elements, and they do say the "headset" package is suitable for singers.

Does anyone have any experience with these mics? We have a 32'w x 24'd stage in a 50' x 70' very LIVE auditorium. The walls are mostly cinderblock, and we have a lot of issues with muddled sound because the place is so live. (We'll be investing in sound dampening curtains next year!)

Thanks in advance for any advice!!
Patty V.
 
Re: Lavalier Mic comparison

How many units do you plan on buying? Sometimes rental is the best route especially for things like wireless mics. If there is no one assigned to take care of them they often end up being a headache. Where as if you have a rental package everything should be configured and tested to work.
Also you can get rental packages with headset mics which more than likely is what you will want to use. The cost of those alone could be more investment than the Samson product you mentioned.
 
Re: Lavalier Mic comparison

Have you considered renting until your budget is larger? Perhaps the thing to do is buy only what you can afford (of the good stuff) and supplement that with renting. then over a few years you'll have quality gear.

And as a heads up, unless you have a great deal of discipline/authority coming from a respected audio operator, you can expect wireless gear to get torn up pretty quickly in theater. And that's from my professional theater experience, let alone the damage that high school kids could do.

The BLX could work for you. Mic placement is ULTRA important in your scenario (the room). Consider adding on Samson's $200 ear set mics would be light years ahead of lavalieres aka lapels.
 
Re: Lavalier Mic comparison

And minutes ahead of me. :D~:-D~:grin:

Patty, I second what the first two have said. I've been in your shoes before (granted as the audio guy and not the director), and you will find that renting gear is the best option for you at this point, or at least incrementally getting into a good quality system. I would suggest headsets if you can, but that's personal preference. I also highly suggest that you get some training and skill in utilizing these microphones and sound systems in general. The biggest flaw in almost every single high school I visit is that their sound techs do not know their gear as well as they should; I even had to explain the mute groups on a GB4 to someone in the middle of their musical's tech week. As always, skillful, well trained operators will trump good equipment anyway in a direct side-by-side comparison.

A note on gear getting torn up - I know that I am told that I'm anal about it by all of my fellow students, but we're one of only 7 schools in the county that haven't broken a microphone during our use of it. Our one failure was by an activities staff member zipping the soft case closed over the capsule… works faster than scissors in removing the capsule.

A side story on gear getting torn up: I can now no longer borrow wireless microphone gear from county central because one school decided that they wanted their headset booms shorter. To accomplish this, they tied the booms in a knot. They worked fine, but when country central tried to unknot them… that was a few thousand out of the budget right then and there.
 
Re: Lavalier Mic comparison

Max Warasila said:
And minutes ahead of me. :D~:-D~:grin:

they tied the booms in a knot. They worked fine, but when country central tried to unknot them… that was a few thousand out of the budget right then and there.
Click to expand...

TIED THEM IN KNOTS!!! :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: Wow
 
Re: Lavalier Mic comparison

Everything posted here is %100 true, do not estimate peoples ability to break things. We have a good stock on Countryman E6 and usually end up replacing at least one after a show run.


Sent from my iPhone
 
Re: Lavalier Mic comparison

This is my opinion, and you can take it or leave it, but I wouldn't buy any wireless for theatre that you can't put on an antenna distro. Without antenna distribution and good remote antennas, you'll have a lot of trouble with dropouts. There's nothing more distracting during a show than when the wireless is cutting out, popping, or otherwise acting up. It takes the audience completely out of whatever world you're trying to put them in. Better wireless will help with that, but you'll never avoid dropouts completely unless you have a distro and the right antennas.

Shure stuff is great, and that's what I have. You'll get more bang for your buck with Sennheiser though. In my experience Sennheiser is the standard for theatre production, from the top to the bottom.

If budget is a concern, the lowest priced wireless I would consider using would be Line6 XD-V75. You can run up to 14 channels, and they have a very reasonably priced 8 output antenna distribution box that when set up correctly can feed all 14 receivers, and their antennas are inexpensive also.

The suggestion to rent is a good one. That is, if there's a rental house in your area with good-quality stuff. Good wireless is expensive. My philosophy has always been do it right, or don't do it at all.

What's the rest of your PA?

Have you considered boundary or hanging mics? A few boundary mics across the front of the stage can work wonders, as can a few choir-type hanging mics dispersed well. A combination of both is great. There are a lot of options for hanging mics, and pretty much anything decent will work fine. As for boundary mics, the standard is the Crown PCC160. I have quite a few of them, and they're great for theatre. I usually space them 7-8' apart across the apron, and anywhere I can put one further upstage, depending on scenery.
 
Re: Lavalier Mic comparison

Hi Patty, Welcome to Sound Forums!

Here is an old thread on Budget Wireless.

High school theatre was my first step into the audio world, and I'm still involved with it on occasion. I know working on a budget is tough, but there's always ways to get around it.

How many of channels are you interested in purchasing, and how many channels of wireless do you intend to use in the future? Where are you located? It would be good to know what the RF situation is like in your area.

I don't think it's worth making a large investment in wireless if your budget is under $1000 / channel (all inclusive).

With that said, when using smaller channel counts, you may be able to get by with some of the lower-end offerings. Build quality and audio quality will generally decrease with cost, while the bandwidth (frequency range) used will increase. As a result, when using larger channel counts, you need higher end wireless.

For lavs, I recommend Countryman's B3, about $150. These take a beating (sweat, makeup) very well, sound good, and will make up their cost increase pretty quickly. For a 'throwaway' lav: Shure WL93, run about $60 each. I haven't had luck with these lasting a long time, but the price is unbeatable and they can sound decent.

Where are you located? I'm sure there's a forum member near you who could chat about rentals. As others have mentioned, rentals my be the best solution for you.
 
Re: Lavalier Mic comparison

Brian Adams said:
If budget is a concern, the lowest priced wireless I would consider using would be Line6 XD-V75. You can run up to 14 channels, and they have a very reasonably priced 8 output antenna distribution box that when set up correctly can feed all 14 receivers, and their antennas are inexpensive also.
Click to expand...

Absolutely +1 regarding the digital Line6 XD-V75 systems. I've got 14 of them with a mix of Countryman B3, B6 and Sennheiser MKE-2s. Unbeatable in terms of sound quality in my opinion. Unlike the cheaper analogue RF gear, you'll get a crystal clear non-companded signal from the capsules, and you can start off with cheap 'throw-away' £30 mics, and upgrade to Countryman B3s, etc for principal actors or more important shows.

The only reason I'd personally consider using anything more expensive is if I needed more than 14 channels, or was particularly concerned about RF stability for a large venue. Having said that, if you position the XD-V75 antennas sensibly, you won't have an issue in any typical theatre scenario. I rented some Sennheiser EW500 systems last month when I needed a few extra channels, and the sound quality from the XD-V75s was noticeably better, despite the Sennheiser kit being twice the price.

In the USA the XD-V75s are about $450/channel, which I appreciate is quite a bit more than the 2 models you're considering at the moment.

Bear in mind that the lapel mics normally bundled with presenter/speech orientated systems will be directional and an absolute nightmare to try and use in a musical theatre situation, without getting a load of cable noise and clothing rustle - especially if there's any dancing! You really need either omnidirectional lavaliers mounted in the hairline (for the most natural sound), taped to the cheek (if you struggle to get enough gain before feedback otherwise), or ear/headsets.
 
Re: Lavalier Mic comparison

Chris Nixon said:
Does anyone know how the V55 compares to the V75? My main interest is regarding RF reliability and Tx durability.

Chris
Click to expand...

Hi Chris,

Aside from the lower simultaneous channel count, the V55 receivers don't have any facility to loop antenna inputs from one receiver to the next. With the V75, you can run 4 receivers from a set of antennas straight from the box - everything you need is included. The V55 would require a separate antenna distributor, or lots of separate antennas. If you rack the receivers together, that's going to be awkward.

it all depends how many channels you want to run at once. If it's more than 3 I'd go with the V75, otherwise the price saving will be negated by the extra antenna splitters and cabling you'll need to run the V55s reliably.

The transmitters are identical in terms of hardware as far as I'm aware - just different software loaded. They're metal and very durable. We had to have some of the mic input connectors replaced under warranty at one point, but that was only an issue on the very early batches from when they were first released.

Hope that helps. Feel free to ask anything else!
 
Top Bottom