Mackie HD1531 & HD1801

Re: Up in smoke!

Robert Kenton said:
Any updates? There has been a few of these tops with problems but how are the subs holding up?
Click to expand...

I personally have had no issues whatsoever with the subs. They are actually very solid performers when used in the types of situations they were designed to handle. Certainly they are a tremendous improvement over previous Mackie powered subs, which never impressed me.
 
Re: Up in smoke!

Jeff Babcock said:
My issue isn't so much about the cab developing a problem, but the knowledge that I can't have access to a quick fix for the problem, which makes the cab having a problem a much bigger problem than it should need to be. Hopefully the turnaround this time will be faster than previous dealings with them........ :(

BTW, opening the amp module up, there is a lot of sloppy hot glue work, stringy bits are everywhere. Should've taken a photo. Don't know if that's necessarily a reflection of quality control, but it's certainly not something I've seen elsewhere to this degree.
Click to expand...

A quick update: Fortunately the repair of the amp module was not too bad. The whole process took about 3 weeks, and costs (out of warranty) approx $150. Apparently the failure was suspected to be from something that worked itself loose inside the amp module which caused a short (hence the "up in smoke" problems I experienced).

I was concerned about parts shortages - a problem with Mackie in the past, but this time around this was a non-issue.
 
Re: Up in smoke!

Alright, Mackie's reliability is back in the dumpster.

I've hit the "busy" season again. These boxes have been seeing quite the workout recently. After this past weekend, the HF amp in one HD1531 is questionable, and I have 1 dead HD1801. The sub goes straight into protect when you turn it on, and the top's horn cuts in and out all the time. Awesome.



Evan
 
Re: Up in smoke!

The power up protect appears to be a common failure mode. Bummer. As a side note, I replaced the diaphragms in a pair of a friend's Mackie S215 passive speakers. These are a cheaper 15" 2-way. They use the P-Audio BMD450 1" drivers which are found in a plethora of lower end boxes including a lot of the Mackies. Not only were the diaphragms cooked, but the plastic phase plugs had unglued themselves and were floating around in the throat hole. Not what I would call quality stuff. After fixing up some JBL and TAD high end compression drivers recently, you really do appreciate quality stuff and why it costs what it does.

Greg
 
Re: Up in smoke!

Hey Evan, how hard have you been pushing these boxes?

It seems as though the Mackie's reputation still holds true to their name. I had thought about buying some of these. (1531's & 1801's). After hearing and reading quite a few horror stories, I'm glad I didn't. I understand trying to be cost effective and producing a low cost, high performance box but the failure rate is unacceptable, IMHO. Seems as though the subs have been holding up a little better than the all of the tops, though.

Pat
 
Re: Up in smoke!

Hi Pat,
I've yet to really mix more than a few shows on these boxes. Most of the time it's other techs that work for me. I have a DSP driving the rig. Subs and tops get their own outputs on the processor and are limited after you're a few dB into GR on the actual speakers. The guys know when you see red on the processor that she's out of gas, and they're normally pretty good about watching their levels(granted I'm not always there to babysit). It's a bummer to see the boxes failing so much, because they do sound damn good, and I've really yet to find a top that will run with the HD1531 in it's price range.

So, I'm hanging onto the tops for now, but the subs are already gone. I've bought some LS800p's to replace them.



Evan
 
Re: Up in smoke!

Evan Kirkendall said:
...It's a bummer to see the boxes failing so much, because they do sound damn good, and I've really yet to find a top that will run with the HD1531 in it's price range...
Click to expand...

This may be inappropriate, but doesn't the phrase "if it sounds too good to be true, it is too good to be true" ring a bell here? It seems that good business purchase decisions aren't often made on price, they're made based on ROI. So why would a business buy a good sounding, crappy speaker, that is known for failing at a gig? Not only is this a bad purchase from the start, but it's going to significantly harm the reputation of the company providing the speakers that are failing at the show. I guarantee the harm to the reputation is going to be worth far more than the difference between the cost of the Mackie box and something twice as expensive.

Just think: buying a box twice as costly as the Mackie (or even 3 times!), is only going to take an additional show or two to recoup, but the stable and growing reputation of the company as a whole is going to be worth far more than that. Why anyone has bothered to buy these Mackie speakers from the beginning has baffled me.

It actually makes sense to buy something from ADR Audio, Meyer, Fulcrum, or whoever, because even though they may cost 3 times as much to start, they're going to be around in 5+ years, still working great, still making you money. If you have to replace the Mackies even once the ROI is gone.

PS - I've learned this the hard way over many years. This is why most successful sound companies have a business-oriented partner to run the financial side of things. They don't have the soundgear-acquiring bias that soundguys always seem to have. :) (I'm not a businessman, just a guy that has GAS)
 
Last edited:
Re: Up in smoke!

Bennett,
I've got a Lake Contour in front of everything. I don't think that's where my problem is. :) The Lake serves primarily as EQ, crossover and a stop sign for the techs driving the rig. The limiters have a slow attack, and don't really kick in until you're really beating on the speakers.

Silas,
I run a SOS company these days. Main focus is dry rentals with the usual local rock shows on top of that. I've had good luck with other Mackie gear in the past. I've got 6 SRM450's that get beat into the ground on a weeky basis and they just keep going. Last year when I was looking for a small, portable, good sounding, active PA for rentals and local shows, the Mackie HD boxes fit the bill. I couldn't find much info on them at the time, so I went for it. They've lasted 8 months without issues. I'm not aiming to do high end gigs with these speakers, and I'm not looking to spend the money on a PA that's just going to get beat on. I'm just looking for something that's going to work.


Evan
 
Re: Up in smoke!

I've got 4 Meyer UPAs that I bought a few years ago now 2nd hand for about the same cost as a set of these Mackies. Now other than replacing the heavy ass amps they came with, (still working, just me that can't move them) these things have worked with no problems at all and yesterday I ran pink noise through them with SMAART and they were all within a couple of db of each other which probably had more to do with my less than accurate placing of speakers and mics than any speaker issue not bad for 12 year old units.
I learnt the hard way years ago about cheap speakers and amps however I can't afford new ones so some trawling of the sound brokers etc and behold good quality units with a good few years life in them. As an aside we have 4 RCF era SRM450s and other than a DJ blowing the crap out of 1 pair they've never been a problem. It would appear that Mackie in common with a lot of other makers of lower price kit have good basic designs but in the attempt to keep costs down lose it in the QC department which is a shame but unless they sort it then their reputations will stay as they are. G

Examples of good 2nd hand buys, UPAs, Meyer CQs and even MSL4s any D+b as long as you get the amps, Nexo Alpha particulaly the "E" for the smaller co,Martin Wave front and Turbo Flood and Flash are also widely available now. EAW kit as well in he US is looking good these days (UX8000) however I've seen some badly processed ones of these and wonder what state they'll be in, there are others but those are the ones I see coming through and from good companies who'll have kept the gear well.
 
Re: Up in smoke!

gordon mcgregor said:
As an aside we have 4 RCF era SRM450s and other than a DJ blowing the crap out of 1 pair they've never been a problem. It would appear that Mackie in common with a lot of other makers of lower price kit have good basic designs but in the attempt to keep costs down lose it in the QC department which is a shame but unless they sort it then their reputations will stay as they are.
Click to expand...

I too have 4 of the old SRMs. Never a problem, still use them all the time. I also have 4 of the original SR1530s. One horn need a new diaphragm due to reduced output. Other than that, no problems. Seem the new stuff doesn't hold up nearly as well. I'm sure people would be willing to spend a bit more if they could make these things more reliably. But Mackie's rep is really taking a beating these days. Maybe they should consider a name change to Ameringer.
 
Re: Up in smoke!

Evan Kirkendall said:
Unfortunately, it doesn't anymore... :(

Damn Mackie...


Evan
Click to expand...

When I had a problem with a HD1531, it was fortunately fixed quickly and rather easily/inexpensively. My main concern with Mackie has been their inability to provide parts and spares, but that was not an issue for me recently. Otherwise, I have had no issues (I have 3 1531s and 2 1801's which serve in a variety of duties like small mains, sidefills, drum fills, etc)

I've had problems with pretty much all of the MI targeted products from different manufacturers at some point. Very few products in that market are close to what I would call bulletproof in my experience. As an example, I can't even remember how many crossovers have died in various Yorkville boxes over the years - and I say this not to pick on Yorkville, but just because many Jr Varsity types think of their gear as a pretty stout.

Agreed that the original SRM450's are reliable workhorses. Though despite Greg's good luck with the old SR1530, I saw many issues (usually amp or LF driver) from folks with those over the years, and sometimes those folks waiting many MONTHS for parts from mackie. I would gladly pay for "reliability modifications" to HD1531's if it would help them, though at this point I am not terribly spooked.

You (usually) get what you pay for. No doubt in my mind, one of Ales' powered boxes or a Meyer will be more reliable and have better quality control. If you determine that you can't afford high quality products, you need to have a plan to deal with issues when they happen - carry spares, whatever. Redundancy is a good thing. If carrying spares isn't practical then perhaps it is worth re-evaluating the ROI on gear such as Ales' stuff.
 
Re: Up in smoke!

Jeff Babcock said:
You (usually) get what you pay for. No doubt in my mind, one of Ales' powered boxes or a Meyer will be more reliable and have better quality control. If you determine that you can't afford high quality products, you need to have a plan to deal with issues when they happen - carry spares, whatever. Redundancy is a good thing. If carrying spares isn't practical then perhaps it is worth re-evaluating the ROI on gear such as Ales' stuff.
Click to expand...

If I have to buy extra, identical product because service/support sucks, I'm buying the wrong product. If I have to carry extra product because I have suspicions about reliability, I'm buying the wrong product.

Not that I don't carry spares on big shows or lack a backup plan/gear for mission critical items (I do)... but if there's a question in my mind about getting through a show without problems, I've done a bad job of system design or a bad job of purchasing. Often, buying the right items has a better ROI than buying extra units of a lesser product.
 
Re: Up in smoke!

Tim McCulloch said:
If I have to buy extra, identical product because service/support sucks, I'm buying the wrong product. If I have to carry extra product because I have suspicions about reliability, I'm buying the wrong product.
Click to expand...

Agreed to some extent Tim, but I am in the habit of carrying extra product in some cases, particularly anything with show stopping potential. Call me a bit paranoid perhaps after all these years seeing all sorts of things happen. I have seen bits of kit from a huge range of manufacturers have issues, not just the cheap MI stuff. Good designs may be less prone to failure, but all gear fails at some point, any person who believes that spending more $ guarantees a fail-proof rig is just setting themselves up for trouble. Spending more in theory just lowers the likelihood.

Back to the Mackies - I really don't have concerns about their reliability during a gig any more or less than other powered boxes in that relatively cheap pricerange. They are fairly unlikely IMHO to fail mid-show as opposed to finding an issue during initial setup. If there is a problem found during setup, how good the support dept at a company is doesn't matter - you need a spare NOW. Whether that means another mackie box or some other "D" rig, my point was just to suggest having something.... anything.... to get by with until you can sort out the issue. If a Mackie box fails for me, it's no big deal if it takes a couple weeks to be fixed, I can use other stuff.

Having a fix for a high end company's box in a few days instead of a few weeks is not really worth the extra expense for me given the intended use I have for the Mackies.
 
Re: Up in smoke!

Jeff Babcock said:
Agreed to some extent Tim, but I am in the habit of carrying extra product in some cases, particularly anything with show stopping potential. Call me a bit paranoid perhaps after all these years seeing all sorts of things happen. I have seen bits of kit from a huge range of manufacturers have issues, not just the cheap MI stuff. Good designs may be less prone to failure, but all gear fails at some point, any person who believes that spending more $ guarantees a fail-proof rig is just setting themselves up for trouble. Spending more in theory just lowers the likelihood.

Back to the Mackies - I really don't have concerns about their reliability during a gig any more or less than other powered boxes in that relatively cheap pricerange. They are fairly unlikely IMHO to fail mid-show as opposed to finding an issue during initial setup. If there is a problem found during setup, how good the support dept at a company is doesn't matter - you need a spare NOW. Whether that means another mackie box or some other "D" rig, my point was just to suggest having something.... anything.... to get by with until you can sort out the issue. If a Mackie box fails for me, it's no big deal if it takes a couple weeks to be fixed, I can use other stuff.

Having a fix for a high end company's box in a few days instead of a few weeks is not really worth the extra expense for me given the intended use I have for the Mackies.
Click to expand...

Hi Jeff-

Actually, we *do* carry spares of one-of-a-kind, mission critical units or at least have a planed work-around.

This issue here, though, is for the level of gig a Mackie HD rig will go to, should we need to send a spare 1531 and 1801 to each gig, i.e. a spare for each 2 or 4 units? In our VerTec rig, we send out 1 spare I-Tech. If the system DSP takes a dive, I can replicate it's functions in console output processing (less than ideal, but we'll get through the show), but we're not needing 25% spares of commodity products like speakers.

The key phrase in my post is "If I have to buy extra, identical..." If we're sufficiently concerned that a unit or units MUST be consistently dispatched with backup, there's a good chance we picked the wrong product or we're doing something stupid with it.

Have fun, good luck.

Tim Mc
 
Top Bottom