Plywood

C

Craig Hauber

Sophomore
Jan 20, 2011
242
1
18
53
Between Williston ND and Plentywood MT
www.mondaksound.com
Found some 11 to 13-ply "veneer core" birch ply in 4x8 sheets at the "Menards" near me. Not used to that chain of home improvement stores yet, but have never seen anything like that type of plywood at Lowe's or H-D. (and from first impressions I liked the store much better than either of those other two I've been using for years)

At $39 a sheet it almost seems too-good-to-be-true. Has anybody used this type before? I bought a few sheets to try.

Also is OSB a valid choice for smaller boxes that are going to end up carpeted? I saw some 1-1/8" thick subfloor panels that intrigued me.
 
Re: Plywood

Craig Hauber said:
Found some 11 to 13-ply "veneer core" birch ply in 4x8 sheets at the "Menards" near me. Not used to that chain of home improvement stores yet, but have never seen anything like that type of plywood at Lowe's or H-D. (and from first impressions I liked the store much better than either of those other two I've been using for years)

At $39 a sheet it almost seems too-good-to-be-true. Has anybody used this type before? I bought a few sheets to try.

Also is OSB a valid choice for smaller boxes that are going to end up carpeted? I saw some 1-1/8" thick subfloor panels that intrigued me.
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Hi Craig-

I vaguely remember some discussion of this product and the consensus was that the core veneers contained significant voids, cracks and splits. There was some speculation that they were a different species, too. For $39, buy a sheet and build something and let us know what you find.

Since you're in the greater L.A. area, I recommend Allied Veneers for orders of any significant size. I think the minimum order was 20 pieces. They have genuine marine grade Baltic birch as well as some other flavors.
 
Re: Plywood

In the past "Menards" had a different fit & feel than Lowe's or H-D. More like a big mom & pop hardware store. They had lot's of products that you just don't see anywhere else. But the nearest stores are 1 & 1/2 and 3 hour drives so I seldom get there.
 
Re: Plywood

Craig those stores are big here in South Dakota, Veneer core would be fine for most "Medium" to light duty applications, But for your heavy stuff use a bit more standardized Ply's, OSB has a decent strength although I wouldn't use it unless I was carpeting or putting a plastic coating on it. They use it on the floors of houses so it is fairly strong. Just not Ply strong.
 
Re: Plywood

Jordan Lahr said:
Craig those stores are big here in South Dakota, Veneer core would be fine for most "Medium" to light duty applications, But for your heavy stuff use a bit more standardized Ply's, OSB has a decent strength although I wouldn't use it unless I was carpeting or putting a plastic coating on it. They use it on the floors of houses so it is fairly strong. Just not Ply strong.
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In the construction industry, OSB is called ole shitty board for a reason.. Don't let it stay damp..Ever..
 
Re: Plywood

Kemper Watson said:
In the construction industry, OSB is called ole shitty board for a reason.. Don't let it stay damp..Ever..
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100% agreed

It won't hold fasteners of any type (that I am aware of) on the end grain.

It swells up liek a balloon when wet and seperates.

It is meant for floors. roofs etc in which the fastener (nail screw) goes through the wood into another piece of wood. Not where the end of the fastener stays in the OSB.

It is like a lot of other things. Often when you see a demo that it is stronger than regular plywood, they are correct-IN THE CONTEXT OF THE DEMO! So in one case it is better-but in most all others it is far worse.

One always has to look at the WHOLE package-not just one little aspect.
 
Re: Plywood

Been cutting on the stuff I bought. Seems no different than baltic birch 13-ply The inner layers aren't as perfect as the ones I've seen in modern fine-furniture but there's minimal to no voids. Sledgehammer testing on scraps is better than the 7-ply birch or fir ply that is the only other stuff available (I have to drive 2-hours to the Menards and that's the nearest place -if not then 4-hours to Billings! The local lumberyard can get me whatever I need on special-order but with a minimum of a full pallet load (30-something sheets) and with a rather robust trucking surcharge :)

I have a bunch of old EV cabinets that appear to be made of OSB and they have held up really well- especially so considering their age! It does appear to be slightly different (thicker "flakes") but was trying to figure something lighter than MDF yet cheaper than plywood for building carpeted boxes for light use or for installs. (And I am in process of actually building a couple houses here so I will be using much OSB for its intended purpose)

Thanks
 
Re: Plywood

Craig Hauber said:
Been cutting on the stuff I bought. Seems no different than baltic birch 13-ply The inner layers aren't as perfect as the ones I've seen in modern fine-furniture but there's minimal to no voids. Sledgehammer testing on scraps is better than the 7-ply birch or fir ply that is the only other stuff available (I have to drive 2-hours to the Menards and that's the nearest place -if not then 4-hours to Billings! The local lumberyard can get me whatever I need on special-order but with a minimum of a full pallet load (30-something sheets) and with a rather robust trucking surcharge :)

I have a bunch of old EV cabinets that appear to be made of OSB and they have held up really well- especially so considering their age! It does appear to be slightly different (thicker "flakes") but was trying to figure something lighter than MDF yet cheaper than plywood for building carpeted boxes for light use or for installs. (And I am in process of actually building a couple houses here so I will be using much OSB for its intended purpose)

Thanks
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There have been a lot of speakers made with OSB over the years. It can work fine given you build it with OSB's strengths and weaknesses in mind.

For cheap speakers that will stay dry, I say go for it. Many manufacturers have done it.
 
Re: Plywood

No offense please, But I'm having a hard time believing you.

I have researched every source 150mi around me and there is no such thing up here in the boonies. Menards is it, and this stuff I just got spanks anything I could find in California for quality and price. Yes the place near my shop had official 5'x5' baltic birch of the highest quality but they got close to $80 a sheet for that and it would have been a shame to use that for a carpeted box. Even the "higher quality" (barely adequate) fir-ply at HD was averaging $45 most of the time too.

Bear it in mind that I'm not looking for 100-sheet lots where even if you could get discounted, the tractor-trailer fuel, dock and forklift requirements at my end would negate any savings.
 
Re: Plywood

Craig Hauber said:
No offense please, But I'm having a hard time believing you.

I have researched every source 150mi around me and there is no such thing up here in the boonies. Menards is it, and this stuff I just got spanks anything I could find in California for quality and price. Yes the place near my shop had official 5'x5' baltic birch of the highest quality but they got close to $80 a sheet for that and it would have been a shame to use that for a carpeted box. Even the "higher quality" (barely adequate) fir-ply at HD was averaging $45 most of the time too.

Bear it in mind that I'm not looking for 100-sheet lots where even if you could get discounted, the tractor-trailer fuel, dock and forklift requirements at my end would negate any savings.
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Hi Craig-

I see you changed your location to Montana from what I presumed was in the greater Los Angeles area. That's quite a relocation!

IIRC I found Allied Veneers through a referral from a big cabinet maker. He didn't buy Baltic birch, but he knew they carried it in both 5' x 5' and 4' x 8' sizes. Freight and minimum order will be your enemies, and I wish there was a better way. Montana is a very interesting place to live (and visit), but getting marine plywood in a land-locked state is expensive.

We're building a few utility trunks this winter (and not enough to justify ordering from Allied) so I'm interested in your experience with the Menards product.
 
Re: Plywood

Also check with anyone in your area receiving shipments from the Far East. I've gotten some 12 ply plywood which came in from the Phillipines as packing crate material. It was in large enough sections and of sufficient quality for building some 12" speaker cabinets. And as "recycled" wood I got it for hauling it away.....
 
Re: Plywood

Just don't butt joint it. Biscuits, dadoes, whatever type of joint turns your crank. Most of the veneered plys have a surface layer that's measured in thousandths. That's a crazy price you're getting quoted for bb. I pay 30-40 bucks a sheet all the time. Granted I buy a LOT, but still.
 
Re: Plywood

Status update:

Been working with the plywood -building a kitchen island and some cabinets actually, I will recommend the stuff and will use it in the future. I'm living on the MT/ND border not too far from Canada and everybody within a 100mi radius cannot beat the price (-whether it's a good or bad price).
I could drive to Billings or Bismarck and get a better price but the fuel and time would negate any savings. There's an explosion of industry and people up here, but much is still lacking in fine-goods and luxury products. I can get house-building grade product by the semi-load for relatively cheap, but fine woodworking materials are non-existant.

The Menards wood is 11-ply with a fairly high quality clear face (not too far from the BB-grade russian stuff I've used in the past) The opposite side is a B, -no knots but with the football-shaped patches

The core plys are very straight with almost non-existant voids (small ones if there is) and no knots that I've found yet

Strength and durability seem really good. I see no reasons why this stuff would behave any different in a trunk, rack or speaker use than "official" russian birch. -The scraps I left outside in the weather didn't fall apart sitting in water and ice. Considering I normally carpet my stuff (yes I'm old fashioned) the quality of surface has never been an issue before but the stained finish I'm planning on my kitchen projects looks quite good.

My only issue is the nasty weather here and having to do cutting in an open carport. Any recommendations for woodworking in a shop that's filled with gear and electronics? (I'll be building another shop next summer I guess! :)
 
Re: Plywood

Craig Hauber said:
My only issue is the nasty weather here and having to do cutting in an open carport. Any recommendations for woodworking in a shop that's filled with gear and electronics? (I'll be building another shop next summer I guess! :)
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Cases for your gear and dust collection for your tools.

I did a major addition to my house about 5 years ago so I could have a nice heated, dedicated shop. The gear lives in the garage next to the shop (16' garage door between that usually stays open) and stays relatively dust free. Simple dust covers and/or plastic work fine as long as the dust isn't actively blown around.

I've had no problems doing small electronics projects in this environment - I brush off the workbench, dig out my tools, and go to town. I've debated about building a little electronics nook in my house, but haven't done any significant enough work to warrant that, yet and it's a pain in the butt hauling the gear to be fixed up and down stairs.

Dust collection is critical. Not sure what kind of tools you have, but you may want to look at the Festool stuff that's been designed with dust collection in mind. I have their track saw, and it's revolutionized how I work with sheet goods. Their miter saw has really great dust collection, and I'm told their routers do, too. I have their orbital/rotary sander and the dust collection is incredible. I used to hate sanding; now it's no big deal.

For christmas I'm asking for a table saw guard with built-in dust collection, as that's currently my biggest offender.
 
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