RGB 3d Lasers

Jeff Babcock

Jeff Babcock

Senior
Jan 11, 2011
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Ontario, Canada
jeffbabcock.org
Hi,

I'm considering purchase of a couple of RGB lasers to add to my small lighting rig.
Blizzard Kaptivator got my attention as pretty capable and not terribly expensive (approx $350 each), also not large enough to require a variance.

kaptivator - YouTube

Has anyone here had much experience with some of the newer RGB laser products, that could comment on how well a pair of these could work in a situation where I've got a stage with something like 8 Mac250's and 10 par64 led equivalent washes?

I realize that their effectiveness will be very haze dependent, but any thoughts as to how well they may work in some ambient light?

I have used lasers before, but only tiny things like a Micro Galaxian, so I am not so sure what these guys will do in the real world, given that lighting is not really my forte. I am particularly interested in the "wash" type effects these can do rather than scattered narrow beams.

Thoughts?

Any insight would be appreciated.
 
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Re: RGB 3d Lasers

I wonder how they consider that to be a class 3R laser, when it says it's 250mw. That would put it into class 3B. A class 3B laser would need a variance.

250mw would be fairly visible with a decent amount of fog, but the Mac 250s's and wash may walk all over it. Keeping the beams in the dark where the wash isn't would be effective.
 
Jeff Babcock said:
Hi,

I'm considering purchase of a couple of RGB lasers to add to my small lighting rig.
Blizzard Kaptivator got my attention as pretty capable and not terribly expensive (approx $350 each), also not large enough to require a variance.

kaptivator - YouTube

Has anyone here had much experience with some of the newer RGB laser products, that could comment on how well a pair of these could work in a situation where I've got a stage with something like 8 Mac250's and 10 par64 led equivalent washes?

I realize that their effectiveness will be very haze dependent, but any thoughts as to how well they may work in some ambient light?

I have used lasers before, but only tiny things like a Micro Galaxian, so I am not so sure what these guys will do in the real world, given that lighting is not really my forte. I am particularly interested in the "wash" type effects these can do rather than scattered narrow beams.

Thoughts?

Any insight would be appreciated.
Click to expand...

You are wasting your time looking at any lasers that don't require a variance.

Sent from my XT907 2
 
Re: RGB 3d Lasers

Jeff Babcock said:
Does anyone know about laser regulations in Canada? I can't seem to find much info regarding whether there is a similar variance process as in the USA, just that it must be IEC 60825 compliant.
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I wonder what your insurance carrier would say when you tell them that you're using a device that can cause instantaneous blindness?
 
Re: RGB 3d Lasers

Silas Pradetto said:
I wonder what your insurance carrier would say when you tell them that you're using a device that can cause instantaneous blindness?
Click to expand...

I wonder that too - event insurance is getting more difficult/costly all the time IME, but what about shows like this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDjZ38elM44

Syndicate 2010 - Lasershow, 1080p Full HD - YouTube

MUSE at O2 Arena 26/10/12 - FOLLOW ME, Laser Show! - YouTube

I wouldn't use them to directly scan a crowd, but how do these sorts of shows get away with it, using very powerful lasers?

Sorry for being such a noob on this subject.....
 
Jeff Babcock said:
I wonder that too - event insurance is getting more difficult/costly all the time IME, but what about shows like this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDjZ38elM44

Syndicate 2010 - Lasershow, 1080p Full HD - YouTube

MUSE at O2 Arena 26/10/12 - FOLLOW ME, Laser Show! - YouTube

I wouldn't use them to directly scan a crowd, but how do these sorts of shows get away with it, using very powerful lasers?

Sorry for being such a noob on this subject.....
Click to expand...

With continuous wave LASERs and the proper galvos you can calculate based on the scan speed the amount of energy that a person will receive.
Then when the show is designed and programmed you can set the amount of time as well as use a high speed blanking device to control the amount of energy emitted while scanning the crowd. From what I can tell, the units used to scan the crowd are usually 3w or less. 30 watt YAg-Nd lasers are only used for sky scanning. Also the crowd scanning galvos take at least 30 seconds to stop moving in the event of a failure. There is an interlock that will send the beam into a beam dump and shut the unit down.

All that being said, we hired a company that specializes in LASER displays when we had a client that wanted one.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus 4
 
Re: RGB 3d Lasers

Of the 3 links to your shows, the Syndicate 2010 show looks dangerous as hell. Not only are they scanning the crowd, they are terminating STATIC BEAMS into the crowd. Good freaking god! Yes, the chance that someone suffered permanent damage from that is pretty high.

The last show looks like the beams are out of the crowd, but the camera operator is positioned above the beam patterns, mostly. Safe, as long as the operator knows when a beam might be coming his way.

The first show looks AWESOME. Tons of high powered beams, all scanning completely safely above the crowd. That's what you're looking for in a laser show! Pretty sure you aren't going to pull that off with a non-variance requiring laser. :)
 
Re: RGB 3d Lasers

Brian jojade said:
Of the 3 links to your shows, the Syndicate 2010 show looks dangerous as hell. Not only are they scanning the crowd, they are terminating STATIC BEAMS into the crowd. Good freaking god! Yes, the chance that someone suffered permanent damage from that is pretty high.

The last show looks like the beams are out of the crowd, but the camera operator is positioned above the beam patterns, mostly. Safe, as long as the operator knows when a beam might be coming his way.

The first show looks AWESOME. Tons of high powered beams, all scanning completely safely above the crowd. That's what you're looking for in a laser show! Pretty sure you aren't going to pull that off with a non-variance requiring laser. :)
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I'd say that most of the second show's lasers that appear to be above the crowd but parallel to the floor are most likely pointed at a wall just underneath a balcony, if I had to guess.
 
Re: RGB 3d Lasers

Jeff, I'm a Blizzard dealer so I'm a little biased but I use 4 of the Kaptivators for my band's light setup and they are pretty impressive. We get more comments about those than any other lights including the 90W mheads.
 
Re: RGB 3d Lasers

Don't bother with crap like that. Head over to photonlexicon.com for good advice. You need to consider the legal requirements depending on your location also. In the US you require a variance and this can be a pain to achieve. Its a total safety focus for the system, not just the projector.

For small clubs you will require at least 3-5W, forget outdoor shows with <20W.

Done right its not cheap. I built my own laser modules and projectors (5W and 2 x 2W) for small/medium venues and it still cost me 15K plus months of research, build time and licensing & registration of hardware. Every single part, optic etc is expensive (when done right). Avoid all Chinese crap. There are a number of good projectors going cheap at photonlexicon at the moment, high quality used. Come on over, a great bunch of pro guys and some enthousiasts roo.

Check out my facebook page for pics of my builds and live shows.
 
Re: RGB 3d Lasers

Wayne Osborn said:
For small clubs you will require at least 3-5W, forget outdoor shows with <20W.

Done right its not cheap. I built my own laser modules and projectors (5W and 2 x 2W) for small/medium venues and it still cost me 15K plus months of research, build time and licensing & registration of hardware.
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Hi Wayne,
Thanks, I will check out the site you mention. However, 15K for a DIY laser rig is way more than I want to invest, let alone part with all of the time and effort to research and build.
I realize that something in the 3-5W range would be ideal, but I am just looking for something suitable for gigs with less than 500 in attendance, small to medium rooms, and not something mind-blowing. My standards for laser wow factor are probably lower than yours.
 
Re: RGB 3d Lasers

Jeff Babcock said:
Hi Wayne,
Thanks, I will check out the site you mention. However, 15K for a DIY laser rig is way more than I want to invest, let alone part with all of the time and effort to research and build.
I realize that something in the 3-5W range would be ideal, but I am just looking for something suitable for gigs with less than 500 in attendance, small to medium rooms, and not something mind-blowing. My standards for laser wow factor are probably lower than yours.
Click to expand...

Cheap small lasers are getting pretty popular, but that doesn't mean that they're a good thing. Many times, people will end up buying some cheap laser that shoots beams randomly, and into the crowd. Reminds me of the days of spin and puke lights. Are you adding laser just to say you have laser? Spending that money on better moving head lights and programming what you have can create a better show.

The jump from spin and puke lasers to quality controlled lasers requires a significant investment in time and money. It's gotten far cheaper and easier in recent years, but it's still not a plug and play environment.
 
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