Variable sound quality, JBL PRX rig

Re: Variable sound quality, JBL PRX rig

This rig would be the envy of any small bar in my area. Most are far to cheep to have a house rig.

Lisa, could you please describe the problem you are having? Under what conditions? Is it live sound? Is it tecno dance EDM? Is it only when the place is packed? Is it when the system is cranked to the max and bouncing off the back wall?
 
Re: Variable sound quality, JBL PRX rig

If you are using any type of auto eq, that is likely the problem right there.


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+1.

I used to own a DRPA. If you want to see a perfect example of comb filtering, run the auto-eq with both sides of the speakers turned on. Go to the eq page when it is done and see what it came up with. Looks just like a comb ;)

I found that the auto-eq on the DRPA (not plus) tended to under emphasize the LF to my ear. It also left the mid highs too hot which results in a brittle sound to the PA.

Give this a try. Take the DRPA out of the loop. Run directly from your mixer to the XLF subs inputs, then run from the XLF outputs directly into the 615's inputs. Leave the 615's eq curve on "mains" not "monitor", and ensure that the XLF's have their cross-over turned on.

You are correct. Running the system like this eliminates any holes in the frequency spectrum. Furthermore, this is how the designers at JBL designed the system to be run.

I don't know many sound pros that like what the auto-eq does to the sound.
 
Re: Variable sound quality, JBL PRX rig

DRPA's make wonderful paperweights - I have one holding down a pile of crap myself here somewhere ;)~;-)~:wink:. What I use is a DBX 223 analog crossover and a Rane MQ302S stereo GEQ.
 
Re: Variable sound quality, JBL PRX rig

To start with the DRPA+: When used with the factory settings for PRX, it overprotects the speakers and totally squashes the sound when you get to any useful level where the PRX comes into their own. This is fairly easy to fix though, turning the input of the PRX up by at least 6 dB from the recommended setting enables you to use the full dynamics of the PRX without too much interference from the DRPA+.
Secondly, when using the auto EQ with pink noise, and providing that the microphone position isn't totally compromised (and in this particular setting, the chances are that it is because of the nature of the room), one really need to review the result and pull down the big boosts that will probably have been applied in a couple of places (again the nature of the room). I've stopped using the DRPA on the mains.

The main problem in a room of this nature is the speaker placement, there really is no good place for a speaker in a room with sealed brick or concrete surfaces. Being close to the wall, there will be a primary null projecting into what one would assume to be the primary listening area in the upper bass, with multiple lobes in the lower midrange. If the wall can't be eliminated from the equation, the best compromise is often to place the speaker as close as one absolutely possibly can to the wall for maximum coupling as high up the register as possible, and turn the speaker away from the wall so that the directivity of the horn can take care of the frequencies higher up.
In the case of the PRX615, it would be tempting to place it on the wall in the monitor position, ie. putting the 45deg side flush with the wall and securing it using additional fly-points to augment the under-speaker support. Even turning one of the speakers upside down to achieve this on both sides (with proper fixing to compensate for the lack of 35mm hole).

To take care of the reflections thay cause havoc in the upper bass and midrange, I'd try and place absorbers on the wall immediately adjacent to the speakers. Having a couple of efficient 6" by 2' by 4' absorbers made up can be a good investment. A multi layer damper-absorber, one layer of 1/2"-1" high density rubber suspended between two sheets of 2" high density mineral fibre, clad with heavy molton. Such devices can be problem solvers in many situations.

Another solution would be to fly the speakers horisontally above the stage, having a 90deg vertical to 50deg horisontal pattern, using them as you would a small constant curvature array.

Two PRX615 should easily fill the room with adequate levels, the problem is probably too much interference from the DRPA+ and serious nulls that influence main listening areas including FOH
 
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Re: Variable sound quality, JBL PRX rig

View attachment 8917view from the desk, see where the ladder is? the subs where under the stage pointing at the ladder wall

View attachment 8918trying to show speaker placement in relation to the wall, sorry, bad photos and dont know how to rotate. still hoping tese pic will help convey a sense of the size and nature of the space

View attachment 8919

Where was this setup done at?

Only curious is all. I am always building speakers an was excited to see another forum member in Adelaide.
 
Re: Variable sound quality, JBL PRX rig

The room is in the Producers hotel *waves to fellow local*.

Since running the EQ wizard, I haven't had any complaints from the client about volume or sound....I poke my head in from time to time, DJ tracks sound alright, bands sound fine. The music that the drag queens bring in always sounds terrible but I've got everyone believing the bad sound is to do with crappy mp3s now (smoke and mirrors right?!)

It stills sounds pretty trebley to me, how does one review and tweak the curve the auto EQ produces?

On the overly cautious limiting, inclined to leave it like that for now, I've already had 3 of these PRX boxes malfunction, squashed and safe is fine by me (although in a future scenario where I am the one using the rig, I shall indeed turn it up at the box for a better sound).

Next challenge, improving the room's acoustics for sure :-)

Thank you for all the responses.
 
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Re: Variable sound quality, JBL PRX rig

The room is in the Producers hotel *waves to fellow local*.

Since running the EQ wizard, I haven't had any complaints from the client about volume or sound....I poke my head in from time to time, DJ tracks sound alright, bands sound fine. The music that the drag queens bring in always sounds terrible but I've got everyone believing the bad sound is to do with crappy mp3s now (smoke and mirrors right?!)

Could be just cold hard reality

It stills sounds pretty trebley to me, how does one review and tweak the curve the auto EQ produces?

http://adn.harmanpro.com/product_do...veRack_PA_Plus_Manual_18-0483V-B_original.pdf

On the overly cautious limiting, inclined to leave it like that for now, I've already had 3 of these PRX boxes malfunction, squashed and safe is fine by me (although in a future scenario where I am the one using the rig, I shall indeed turn it up at the box for a better sound).

squashed is not necessarily safe.
Next challenge, improving the room's acoustics for sure :-)

Thank you for all the responses.

I recommend re-reading Scot Bolts last post a few more times.

As both a drivrack PA and JBL active owner and user owner and user I have the following comment: JBL active in general do not need auto EQ ever. They are smooth and require little or no EQ to sound fantastic.

The driverrack auto EQ function is all but useless. After running it it may seem to sound "better" for a while until you realize your audio has been "hacksawed" to death.
 
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