Midas Pro 1

Re: Midas Pro 1

One of my customers just picked his up and says the flight case is substantial, with doghouse and keyboard tray. It sounds like a bargain at the price difference between the install and tour pack, but we are shopping for a lighter case so he can handle it alone.
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

Currently I have a email into Jason Kelly to check out the Con's I had about the desk and I'm waiting for a reply to see if maybe he's knows of some work arounds. But in the mean time I can say that I think Midas needs to address the Sends on Fader notification's on the desk. Currently it gives you 3 places to see if your in Sends on Fader mode. 1 the led light on the aux button lights up. 2 the lcd select button/screen says mono aux. 3 the screen changes right above the fader and shows the aux number you using on Sends on Fader. I believe they should change this and make a header at the top of the screen that flashes "SENDS ON FADER AUX 1" because if your screen is in effects or preferences or some other function then you have lost the visual reference on the screen. When your in direct sunlight the aux led light is impossible to see. So the only visual reference you have left is the lcd select button/screen that says mono aux which is written out in super micro print. Or maybe they can flash the select button/screen's when sends on fader is engaged.

I was mixing a band with all IEM's from foh and I couldn't use the faders as a visual reference seeing the mixes looked almost identical to the foh mix. I almost killed the drummer at sound check with lead guitar in his mix because I thought I was in foh mix.

I can say the desk sounds completely amazing. You will not find another desk in this price point that sounds this good. The 780 reverb is the best I have ever used and all the dynamics processing is so transparent. The overall sound quality is simply amazing to say the least. If your shopping for a small format desk do not skip this one. Try it you will buy it.

Hi Brian,

I did get your email and I will reply as soon as I can. We've all been down at the PLASA trade show this last week, first day in the office today, so a lot to catch up on.

Thank you for taking the time to detail your experiences so far to me and as I said I'll get some answers back to you as soon as I can. But I'm very glad to hear that over all your initial experiences of the PRO1 have been positive.

Jason
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

Brian Wynn;36604 I can say the desk sounds completely amazing. You will not find another desk in this price point that sounds this good. The 780 reverb is the best I have ever used and all the dynamics processing is so transparent. The overall sound quality is simply amazing to say the least. If your shopping for a small format desk do not skip this one. Try it you will buy it.[/QUOTE said:
I am highly considering the Pro 1, hoping for a demo from our rep shortly. I didn't want to start another thread about Pro 1 but have a specific use question for you, Brian, or anyone who has one already. Tell me if you think this makes sense.

We do a bunch of festival arena events in which we are providing a racks n stacks PA for a number of artists with their own consoles, as well as a Profile or SC48 of our own for the openers. We invariably are patching at least two, if not three or four FOH consoles into our system. We also require an additional small console for videos, music playback, and MCs during changeovers while the Avid desks load show files, band engineers twiddle knobs, etc etc.

We also are looking for a way to convert to Dante at FOH. The KT DN9650 Network Bridge can convert from the AES550 to Dante, so that works there, right?

So, we would use the Pro 1 as a big FOH matrix mixer, and as a way to convert to Dante. An analog to digital "MixSwitch". It also would have the extra inputs for MC, playback, video, etc.

The Lab Gruppen LM44s could do this task but wouldn't be much less expensive as you would need at least two, if not three of them. And the Pro 1 would be a console that would have other uses at other events. Put a stage box on stage and you could even do your acoustic openers and DJs.

Seems smart to me, what am I missing?

Will band engineers be cool plugging their console into a Pro 1 assuming it stays digital from that point on? I never asked with our LS9-16 since, rightly or wrongly, I knew what the answer was :) We used to just swap inputs on our system processors.

Will I be able to use the AES input into the desk from the artist consoles? Should I provide a clock for that or is AES happy without? If I have to clock, I would doubt that every artist engineer would be cool with us clocking their console, and I would guess if getting a feed from multiple console that I would need an external clock.

Sorry for all the questions :) I have little experience with AES, we typically use CobraNet for our other rig. Maybe Jason from Midas could chime in regarding the AES stuff...

Thanks,
Jason
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

I am highly considering the Pro 1, hoping for a demo from our rep shortly. I didn't want to start another thread about Pro 1 but have a specific use question for you, Brian, or anyone who has one already. Tell me if you think this makes sense.

We do a bunch of festival arena events in which we are providing a racks n stacks PA for a number of artists with their own consoles, as well as a Profile or SC48 of our own for the openers. We invariably are patching at least two, if not three or four FOH consoles into our system. We also require an additional small console for videos, music playback, and MCs during changeovers while the Avid desks load show files, band engineers twiddle knobs, etc etc.

We also are looking for a way to convert to Dante at FOH. The KT DN9650 Network Bridge can convert from the AES550 to Dante, so that works there, right?

So, we would use the Pro 1 as a big FOH matrix mixer, and as a way to convert to Dante. An analog to digital "MixSwitch". It also would have the extra inputs for MC, playback, video, etc.

The Lab Gruppen LM44s could do this task but wouldn't be much less expensive as you would need at least two, if not three of them. And the Pro 1 would be a console that would have other uses at other events. Put a stage box on stage and you could even do your acoustic openers and DJs.

Seems smart to me, what am I missing?

Will band engineers be cool plugging their console into a Pro 1 assuming it stays digital from that point on? I never asked with our LS9-16 since, rightly or wrongly, I knew what the answer was :) We used to just swap inputs on our system processors.

Will I be able to use the AES input into the desk from the artist consoles? Should I provide a clock for that or is AES happy without? If I have to clock, I would doubt that every artist engineer would be cool with us clocking their console, and I would guess if getting a feed from multiple console that I would need an external clock.

Sorry for all the questions :) I have little experience with AES, we typically use CobraNet for our other rig. Maybe Jason from Midas could chime in regarding the AES stuff...

Thanks,
Jason
Fine idea, but you would need a DL351 rack to get enough AES inputs. You will need to use the SRC in the DL351, as no sensible touring engineer will let you clock his system from an external clock.
Look hard at a Digico SD-11 with a SD-Minirack with AES and Dante cards in it...
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

I am highly considering the Pro 1, hoping for a demo from our rep shortly. I didn't want to start another thread about Pro 1 but have a specific use question for you, Brian, or anyone who has one already. Tell me if you think this makes sense.

We do a bunch of festival arena events in which we are providing a racks n stacks PA for a number of artists with their own consoles, as well as a Profile or SC48 of our own for the openers. We invariably are patching at least two, if not three or four FOH consoles into our system. We also require an additional small console for videos, music playback, and MCs during changeovers while the Avid desks load show files, band engineers twiddle knobs, etc etc.

We also are looking for a way to convert to Dante at FOH. The KT DN9650 Network Bridge can convert from the AES550 to Dante, so that works there, right?

So, we would use the Pro 1 as a big FOH matrix mixer, and as a way to convert to Dante. An analog to digital "MixSwitch". It also would have the extra inputs for MC, playback, video, etc.

The Lab Gruppen LM44s could do this task but wouldn't be much less expensive as you would need at least two, if not three of them. And the Pro 1 would be a console that would have other uses at other events. Put a stage box on stage and you could even do your acoustic openers and DJs.

Seems smart to me, what am I missing?

Will band engineers be cool plugging their console into a Pro 1 assuming it stays digital from that point on? I never asked with our LS9-16 since, rightly or wrongly, I knew what the answer was :) We used to just swap inputs on our system processors.

Will I be able to use the AES input into the desk from the artist consoles? Should I provide a clock for that or is AES happy without? If I have to clock, I would doubt that every artist engineer would be cool with us clocking their console, and I would guess if getting a feed from multiple console that I would need an external clock.

Sorry for all the questions :) I have little experience with AES, we typically use CobraNet for our other rig. Maybe Jason from Midas could chime in regarding the AES stuff...

Thanks,
Jason

I would have to disagree with Dan because you could set the desk up so that in your effects rack you use the matrix mixer and seeing this platform is a "network system" you can take the XLR inputs from the back of the desk and feed them to the matrix mixer in the effects rack and have a 24 x 24 matrix mixer. Check this video out.

Midas Pro1 Matrix Mixer Tour - YouTube

If the Ls9 worked for you I don't seen why this wouldn't. It sounds so much better. I don't think anyone would have a problem with this little guy driving the PA.

You will be lacking on AES inputs if you need more than 4 channels. The DL351 with the AES card would work but then dollars may become an issue.
As far as AES goes the Pro1 has 2 AES in's. Im sure thats not enough for your needs if you have more than one FOH desk running AES. I currently use one pair of the AES inputs with a iPod dock from cambridge audio that has AES on it. That way I don't have to eat up a pair of mic pre's. I don't have to clock to the dock. Although I have limited experience with AES myself. Tried it once on the drive lines into my Itech HD's and didn't seen the advantage. I'm sure Jason Kelly can shed more light on that subject.

I know the DN9650 works well I have seen a few people recording with it into Dante VS software and also seen a few guys using it with the MADI card to record too. And recently seen a system with a Yamaha desk driving dante out to the dn9650 going aes50 in to the dl251 to a dl252. Imagine that a Yamaha desk that sounds like a Midas who would have thunk it?
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

I would have to disagree with Dan because you could set the desk up so that in your effects rack you use the matrix mixer and seeing this platform is a "network system" you can take the XLR inputs from the back of the desk and feed them to the matrix mixer in the effects rack and have a 24 x 24 matrix mixer. Check this video out.

Midas Pro1 Matrix Mixer Tour - YouTube

Thanks for the link. That looks like the ticket.



If the Ls9 worked for you I don't seen why this wouldn't. It sounds so much better. I don't think anyone would have a problem with this little guy driving the PA.

The LS9 in this case was used only for MC, video, and playback. All artist consoles, and our Profile, etc, we were plugging directly into the system processors. Which is what I would be trying to avoid with this purchase :)



You will be lacking on AES inputs if you need more than 4 channels. The DL351 with the AES card would work but then dollars may become an issue.

As far as AES goes the Pro1 has 2 AES in's. Im sure thats not enough for your needs if you have more than one FOH desk running AES. I currently use one pair of the AES inputs with a iPod dock from cambridge audio that has AES on it. That way I don't have to eat up a pair of mic pre's. I don't have to clock to the dock. Although I have limited experience with AES myself. Tried it once on the drive lines into my Itech HD's and didn't seen the advantage. I'm sure Jason Kelly can shed more light on that subject.

While I'd be thrilled to use the AES inputs, assuming it is correctly done in regards to clocking (however that would be), I don't know that it is crucial. Most every artist tech that I've worked with has a loom with analog L R Sub Fronts hanging out for me. If we can make the digital input work, great, but since the signal will be hitting the amps as Dante from the Pro 1, it doesn't add any additional A/D converters then the old way.

Buying the more expensive stage rack (instead of the DL251), and then having to keep it at FOH (instead of using it as the stage snake) for the AES inputs probably is not within the realistic realm of the project at this point. Perhaps once we have other Pro series inventory it will be within easier reach.


Which brings me to next question. We are buying another large format console, Pro2 or another SC48? Just kidding, lets keep this thread on the Pro 1...


Thanks for the advice!
Jason
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

Jason,

A couple thoughts, AES has word clock info included with the data so definitely no WC needed. Plus if a snake oil word clock makes a Yamaha sound better it might make a Midas sound worse, right? JK. But seriously, not needed.

While the Pro1 only has enough AES ins for one console, I think it would be workable to give those to the headliner and let everyone else get the same AD-DA flop that they had to deal with the day before and the next day. When I was your SE last month the headliner didn't even ask, the 2nd band asked if I had AES in, "no, sorry", "meh, ok", so I don't think it's a deal breaker. Alternately, if you want to be really crazy your PLMs are kind of like an LM44 with an amp stuck on the back. You could leave your spare PLM out at FOH and basically just use it as an AES to Dante converter, giving you 4 more AES (EDIT: 2 AES in per PLM) channels. FWIW, you could do that with your system now.


Midas says the inputs are mic/line. I don't know if they're relay switched between the two, but it probably wouldn't be a bad idea to do some bench testing of that on your demo to make sure it'll be happy taking in analog drive lines.

Other than that it seems like a good idea. Seems like a better idea if you're able to get a Pro2 with a stagebox down the road, so the Midas' can go out as a pair and do a digital split on one day and go out as two systems the next.

thomas d.
 
Last edited:
Re: Midas Pro 1

I try to limit my conversions to two. My console is one. Your dsp is the second, and hopefully that's it. I also try never to run through another console, but understand that at festivals utilizing something like an XL88 might be necessary, and using a pro 1 makes sense. having MC's, music, etc. in that console saves a lot of hassle for visiting engineers. If the signal stays digital once it hits the Pro 1, I can't see why anyone would have an issue with it.

Does anyone know the weight of the console in the "Pro1/tp" case? The console weighs 47.5 lbs. I'm hoping to find a solution that keeps the cased console weight under 70 pounds to be checked baggage.
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

Currently I have a email into Jason Kelly to check out the Con's I had about the desk and I'm waiting for a reply to see if maybe he's knows of some work arounds. But in the mean time I can say that I think Midas needs to address the Sends on Fader notification's on the desk. Currently it gives you 3 places to see if your in Sends on Fader mode. 1 the led light on the aux button lights up. 2 the lcd select button/screen says mono aux. 3 the screen changes right above the fader and shows the aux number you using on Sends on Fader. I believe they should change this and make a header at the top of the screen that flashes "SENDS ON FADER AUX 1" because if your screen is in effects or preferences or some other function then you have lost the visual reference on the screen. When your in direct sunlight the aux led light is impossible to see. So the only visual reference you have left is the lcd select button/screen that says mono aux which is written out in super micro print. Or maybe they can flash the select button/screen's when sends on fader is engaged.

I was mixing a band with all IEM's from foh and I couldn't use the faders as a visual reference seeing the mixes looked almost identical to the foh mix. I almost killed the drummer at sound check with lead guitar in his mix because I thought I was in foh mix.

I can say the desk sounds completely amazing. You will not find another desk in this price point that sounds this good. The 780 reverb is the best I have ever used and all the dynamics processing is so transparent. The overall sound quality is simply amazing to say the least. If your shopping for a small format desk do not skip this one. Try it you will buy it.

Dear Brian,

I can finally report back after clearing my PLASA backlog (or at least enough to write this).

I'm happy to say that the ability to 'unlink' the L+R buss (allowing separate master faders among other things) and also linking of L+R to Mono (as per the other PRO Series consoles) will be added in the next software update.

We will also be addressing your concerns of the access to mixes and the UI involved in the Flip Mode, hopefully in that same update. I obviously can't go into details at this point, but our UI team have started looking at it already.

Thanks for your input and I hope this reply helps,

Jason
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

I would have to disagree with Dan because you could set the desk up so that in your effects rack you use the matrix mixer and seeing this platform is a "network system" you can take the XLR inputs from the back of the desk and feed them to the matrix mixer in the effects rack and have a 24 x 24 matrix mixer. Check this video out.

Midas Pro1 Matrix Mixer Tour - YouTube

If the Ls9 worked for you I don't seen why this wouldn't. It sounds so much better. I don't think anyone would have a problem with this little guy driving the PA.

You will be lacking on AES inputs if you need more than 4 channels. The DL351 with the AES card would work but then dollars may become an issue.
As far as AES goes the Pro1 has 2 AES in's. Im sure thats not enough for your needs if you have more than one FOH desk running AES. I currently use one pair of the AES inputs with a iPod dock from cambridge audio that has AES on it. That way I don't have to eat up a pair of mic pre's. I don't have to clock to the dock. Although I have limited experience with AES myself. Tried it once on the drive lines into my Itech HD's and didn't seen the advantage. I'm sure Jason Kelly can shed more light on that subject.

I know the DN9650 works well I have seen a few people recording with it into Dante VS software and also seen a few guys using it with the MADI card to record too. And recently seen a system with a Yamaha desk driving dante out to the dn9650 going aes50 in to the dl251 to a dl252. Imagine that a Yamaha desk that sounds like a Midas who would have thunk it?

Hi Guys,

The idea of using a PRO1 as a XL88 'on steroids' had crossed our minds. In fact I did exactly that using a PRO2c (all the prototype PRO1's were out on beta test!) earlier this year at the T in the Park Festival, in Scotland. We had the video, DJ, announcement mics etc all running straight into the PRO2c. We then took the house XL8's in via AES50 connections. We also had 3 x XLR analogue and 2 x AES pairs for visiting engineer consoles. Obviously the analogue lines were running through the mic amp, but we had no problems at all over the weekend with headroom and all the engineers seemed happy with the results. I know this may not always be the case, but for us it worked extremely well.

We used a POP group for each set of inputs for visiting consoles and VCA groups for all the local stuff. So access was very direct and we could show any engineer that was interested exactly how their signal flow was moving through the system very quickly and easily. No EQ or processing in the PRO2c (apart from announcement mic's and DJ obviously!) was used, it was literally a distribution point. All the engineers seemed very happy with that aspect of the system.

Because both the AES inputs/outputs on the back of the surfaces of the PRO Series (and also the DL452 AES card used in the DL Series I/O boxes) have a sample rate converter per input/output pair there was no need to clock anyone console to the house system. They worked as they normally would, if they wanted to output 96kHz audio they could. But if their console was 48kHz that also was not a problem.

All in all it was a very neat solution and worked seamlessly. Of course a PRO1 would be a lot more cost effective and offer more local i/o on the back. But I only had the PRO2c available to me at the time.

Hope this clears things up a little.
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

Jason great to have you hear to answer questions and concerns. I've been thinking if these is an official Midas Pro series forum or user group, where members can ask questions, talk about missing features, discuss workaround for features not available yet and so far, where you and/or other Midas employees are part and answer questions when you have answers and time?

If not I would like to suggest an official "Midas Pro series discussion" thread on this forum, where all concerns, tricks, questions and feature suggestion could live in one post, making frequently asked questions available in a single post and saving from making a new thread every time someone has a question related to the Pro series (even better if that thread would be made sticky). Having an employee like yourself active on an online forum is in my opinion a great user support, since forums often include discussions and questions that otherwise would never make their way to the manufacturer, and employees are often able to point out reasons things aren't this way or the other, and notify if a feature is up for discussion or planned for future software updates. Most questions concerning products I've been trying to find online have usually wind up on a forum rather than manufacturer data available on their website.
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

Dear Brian,

I can finally report back after clearing my PLASA backlog (or at least enough to write this).

I'm happy to say that the ability to 'unlink' the L+R buss (allowing separate master faders among other things) and also linking of L+R to Mono (as per the other PRO Series consoles) will be added in the next software update.

We will also be addressing your concerns of the access to mixes and the UI involved in the Flip Mode, hopefully in that same update. I obviously can't go into details at this point, but our UI team have started looking at it already.

Thanks for your input and I hope this reply helps,

Jason


It does help Jason. Thank you for taking the time to answer.

BW
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

Jason great to have you hear to answer questions and concerns. I've been thinking if these is an official Midas Pro series forum or user group, where members can ask questions, talk about missing features, discuss workaround for features not available yet and so far, where you and/or other Midas employees are part and answer questions when you have answers and time?

If not I would like to suggest an official "Midas Pro series discussion" thread on this forum, where all concerns, tricks, questions and feature suggestion could live in one post, making frequently asked questions available in a single post and saving from making a new thread every time someone has a question related to the Pro series (even better if that thread would be made sticky). Having an employee like yourself active on an online forum is in my opinion a great user support, since forums often include discussions and questions that otherwise would never make their way to the manufacturer, and employees are often able to point out reasons things aren't this way or the other, and notify if a feature is up for discussion or planned for future software updates. Most questions concerning products I've been trying to find online have usually wind up on a forum rather than manufacturer data available on their website.

Hi Arni,

Before I worked for Midas Klark Teknik I was on the other side of the desk (and the cheque book), I've always felt that this gave me a good perspective on what it's like to be an owner/end user of Pro Audio equipment. I was also a (fairly!) active member of the old LAB forum for many year before I do what I do now. Things have changed a lot since (Social Media etc etc) so its not always easy to keep on top of things, but we try our best.

The main reason we don't have an 'official' user forum at the moment is because our current website doesn't support it. We are in the middle of designing a new website that does support this kind of use and we hope to get this up and running as soon as possible.

In the mean time there are various options available. This Facebook group (https://www.facebook.com/groups/277557352273648/) is a very active forum and well worth joining if you are part of the Facebook fraternity. If you are part of LinkedIn here's a new group to try (Midas Consoles User Group | LinkedIn). There are others around and I try and be as involved as I can be in the other ones.

It's really up to the moderators of this forum about whether your suggestion of a dedicated thread for Midas Digital products would be of benefit. If the consensus is that its a good idea I'll do my best to support in.

Thanks
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

The main reason we don't have an 'official' user forum at the moment is because our current website doesn't support it. We are in the middle of designing a new website that does support this kind of use and we hope to get this up and running as soon as possible.

In the mean time there are various options available. This Facebook group (https://www.facebook.com/groups/277557352273648/) is a very active forum and well worth joining if you are part of the Facebook fraternity. If you are part of LinkedIn here's a new group to try (Midas Consoles User Group | LinkedIn). There are others around and I try and be as involved as I can be in the other ones.

Thank you, this is why I think it's great having you active on this forum. You always give reasonable, well explained answers to any questions. Not just say "thats just the way it is".
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

I used the pro1 this weekend for the first time but didn´t really have time to test and learn as much as I would have wanted to but it felt like the compressors were quite aggressive. How much compression is the soft-clipping feature of the analog pre´s inducing? I mostly used the analog gains so maybe it affected my perception of the compressors. Otherwise I really enjoyed the console but comming from an all Yamaha background it took some getting used to how to navigate it. Is there an easier way to turn on the aux sends for channels? Now I just clicked the down arrow til i got to the sends section and pressed the assignable button turning the send on.

Is there by the way any explanation of the different compressor modes and EQ shapes?
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

I used the pro1 this weekend for the first time but didn´t really have time to test and learn as much as I would have wanted to but it felt like the compressors were quite aggressive. How much compression is the soft-clipping feature of the analog pre´s inducing? I mostly used the analog gains so maybe it affected my perception of the compressors. Otherwise I really enjoyed the console but comming from an all Yamaha background it took some getting used to how to navigate it. Is there an easier way to turn on the aux sends for channels? Now I just clicked the down arrow til i got to the sends section and pressed the assignable button turning the send on.

Is there by the way any explanation of the different compressor modes and EQ shapes?

I would hope the system tech that came with the rig would know these things, be able to demonstrate them and explain them to your satisfaction. If not, chalk this up to another FAIL.
 
Re: Midas Pro 1

I would hope the system tech that came with the rig would know these things, be able to demonstrate them and explain them to your satisfaction. If not, chalk this up to another FAIL.

He just got the console a couple of days before I got it and despite that he got me up and running very fast and the gig went just fine despite a tight schedule. I was more hoping to get helpful hints how to best work with the console.