Help me understand Avid's consoles and software

Andrew Broughton

Andrew Broughton

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Feb 2, 2011
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I almost never use AVID desks but this summer I'll be doing some festivals where an AVID will be supplied for FOH. I assume the SC48, but I understand that all the Venue line is similar?

What I keep hearing (3rd hand) is that there's "issues" with firmware versions and compatibility with plug-ins. Is that true?
I'm not planning to bring any of my own plug-ins, so I expect this to not be an issue, however, I do want to build a show file on my computer ahead of time.
So, is it common for providers to update their AVID consoles to the latest software or do I need to have different files of different versions depending on what the local console firmware is?

How do you guys that do fly-ins work with the varying software versions, or is it no longer an issue?

Thanks in advance for any advice you can give me.
 
Re: Help me understand Avid's consoles and software

Firmware in the wild is the same as for most consoles - most providers keep up to date, a few don't. Avid hasn't helped much, as major updates have cost several hundred dollars each.

That being said, if you keep things simple and only use the stock plugins there shouldn't be show-stopping backwards compatibility issues. The most annoying thing that you'll run into is that you can't do much of anything plugin-related with just the software; you need an actual console to deal with that stuff.
 
Re: Help me understand Avid's consoles and software

In the US and Europe I have been on Venue for 8 or so years. When I go to South America, Australia, or do a fly date I bring my show file on a USB drive. I have never had a firmware issue. My show is fairly simple, so maybe if you are digging deep into the features there might be compatibility issues with firmware versions, but I have not come across them. On an SC48, D Show, or Profile the software is identical. Some have fewer plug in slots than others, but that is the only difference I am aware of. On S3L (Venue 4.5) you get parametric and dynamics on each output. You also get a media page that allows you to playback and record via USB drive. Other than that the functionality is the same.

One thing to know is that unless I am mistaken, the offline software will not all you to work with plug ins. You need to assign and dial those in on an actual console. The only other issue I have had is that the delay plug ins do not transfer from SC48/Profile/DShow to an S3l. All the other plug ins I have used translate.
 
Re: Help me understand Avid's consoles and software

Thanks, guys. That information helps.

The thing that's weird is there are so many different versions of the standalone software available to be downloaded, but Avid claims that all versions are backwards compatible. If that's the case, why would you not just use the latest (4.5) to build your showfile?
Versions 2.7/2.8/2.9/3.0/4.1/4.5 are all available...

What version of standalone do you guys use when working with the SC48 or Profile?
 
Re: Help me understand Avid's consoles and software

You are able to do everything but the actual plugins. You can build snap shots all your I/O, mute groups etc. Not sure what more you are looking to do?
 
Re: Help me understand Avid's consoles and software

Andrew, I use the same version of stand alone that is on our Venue desks - 3.x. I recall that V3 doubled the number of slots in the plug in racks, added "variable groups" as another type of mix bus, and did a fair bit of housekeeping. I don't recall it creating any problems with existing show files when we upgraded from v2.9.

What it takes a real console to do: "instantiate" plug ins in the racks and anything else that is hardware-resource dependent. If you save a show from the desk and open it with the stand alone, the plug ins will show up but you won't be able to do anything with them.

When you load a show file, either from the Filing tab or when booting up the desk, you're "building" the console's virtual existence and each build is optimized for the amount of DSP available. This is the local desk problem you might run into - SC48 and MixRack systems have only 2 mix engine (DSP) cards. The SC48 doesn't have room for any more; the MixRack has room for 1 more (total of 3), and Stage/FOH rack systems ship with 3 cards and has room for 2 more (total 5). If you build a show that requires a bunch of resource-hogging plug ins, virtually configured with full 96x32 i/o, plus 24 buses and internal graphic EQ on every output, you'll find that your show won't load completely on less well appointed Venue. If you're carrying the desk this doesn't matter....
 
Re: Help me understand Avid's consoles and software

No. When you load your show file it will reconfigure to your configuration. You will need to route the outputs to the system, but everything else should be ready to go.
 
Re: Help me understand Avid's consoles and software

Andrew Broughton said:
Is that the normal procedure for a festival? i.e. Rather than importing a snapshot (if that's even possible)
Click to expand...

No, it is not possible to import individual snapshots. Loading your Show File is the accepted way even at festivals. Playing festivals where the system guy is on top of stuff, he'll take your flash drive and plug it into a stand-alone computer, open your Show File, make any output routing changes needed to conform to the physical world and save it with a new name, to be loaded into the desk.
 
Re: Help me understand Avid's consoles and software

Andrew Broughton said:
Thanks, Tim.
What if the system drive (eq/delay, etc.) is handled from the desk? Can that be protected when loading a new show file, or would the system tech copy over that stuff from his showfile somehow?
Click to expand...

No. In a festival situation where the BE cannot do an alignment (no time, etc) then the system should have a controller for basic system EQ, delay and zone control, already in use. Or if FF/MAIN/SUB delays are being done on the desk, the system tech can enter those when he checks the output patching in your show file.
 
Re: Help me understand Avid's consoles and software

Andrew Broughton said:
Thanks, Tim.
What if the system drive (eq/delay, etc.) is handled from the desk? Can that be protected when loading a new show file, or would the system tech copy over that stuff from his showfile somehow?
Click to expand...

Tim McCulloch said:
No. In a festival situation where the BE cannot do an alignment (no time, etc) then the system should have a controller for basic system EQ, delay and zone control, already in use. Or if FF/MAIN/SUB delays are being done on the desk, the system tech can enter those when he checks the output patching in your show file.
Click to expand...

At the festivals we do, you already are going to have to have a processor that can handle multiple inputs from a second console to deal with MC, playback, video, etc OR run the Avid and any guest consoles into the second desk for matrixing.

Remember the Avids can take more than a full minute to load a show completely by the time it is finished loading all the plugins. That is too long for the PA to be off in my opinion.

Jason
 
Re: Help me understand Avid's consoles and software

I would suggest creating a snapshot that only includes preamp settings. That way if you run into a festival situation that won't patch you one to one, you can recall that snapshot and be ready to go. Preamp settings stay with the input, not the channel. Make sense?

The laptop running the software situation works very well at festivals. Even if some alignment is being done in the console, the tech can add that in on the laptop before loading the show on the actual console. I have to say though I've never run into that. Pretty much everyone on the level of providing Venue at a festival has Lake/Galileo/XTA/Armonia/etc.
 
Re: Help me understand Avid's consoles and software

Actually you can import individual snapshots, in the filing/load page you can right click a file and select import snapshots. But that's definitely not the way to do festivals.

Tim McCulloch said:
No, it is not possible to import individual snapshots. Loading your Show File is the accepted way even at festivals. Playing festivals where the system guy is on top of stuff, he'll take your flash drive and plug it into a stand-alone computer, open your Show File, make any output routing changes needed to conform to the physical world and save it with a new name, to be loaded into the desk.
Click to expand...
 
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