Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

lBrent Handy said:
I was mixing about 10 years before you started on major tours with Grammy CMA, GMA, etc artists in all kinds of genres. Mixing IS easy if you have an ear and you know what is going on. If you have to work hard at it, you should stop IMO. It is not your calling.
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Forgive me for finding that statement very humorous. No disrespect, but you are really trivializing a skill that can never be perfected and requires a lifetime quest to improve. Mixing at a professional level is a lot more than moving some faders and twisting some knobs. If it were not so, there would certainly be no place in the world for "superstar" mixers. The "best guys" you reference have thousands upon thousands of hours of top-level experience - hardly representative of the larger industry.

In audio, regardless of skill level, you should always be finding "the more I know, the more I realize how much I don't know". If you can't say that, expect plateau or death of creativity.
 
Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Regardless of the state and future of SAC, regardless of people's opinions of mixing with that particular product and wether mixing is easy or incredibly difficult, it is an arguable fact that devices supporting AES50 are becoming more aboundant and affordable. An affordable and stable AES50 interface that can negotiate Behringer and Midas formats and can remote the respective preamps can be an attractive product for anyone owning a Behringer or Midas stagebox and using a computer to record, livemix, distribute or whatever.
 
Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Brent Handy said:
It is not rocket science. It is an art as much as it is anything else, the more you do it, the better you are at it (hopefully) and if you find it hard to do it, then it is not right for you, or you need some more education/experience. That is the point. I am not saying that it is not demanding or sophisticated. It is. The most demanding for me were the HR and PR elements. I was a little too cut and dry, not PC enough, for those elements. Those are things I worked on. Iron sharpens iron, and I got a bunch of iron rubbing me the wrong way occasionally (usually by rookie bands and managers with no clue, no clout, no budget no patience and bouncing checks). But, the older I got, the more I learned what was important and relaxed a bit.
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A very successful studio owner / businessman / musician / producer / sound engineer once said to me, "Sound engineering isn't all about plugging boxes in and twiddling knobs. Anyone can plug boxes in! Good sound engineering is about managing the artiste and getting the best out of them because when they give you their best, your job becomes easier."

It is a quote I have lived my entire pro audio career by and I believe it has served me well. I can apply it to virtually every scenario of professional audio and a good deal of other industries. I've lost count of the number of times I've been told, "Our sound is always great when you do it because you don't have your head buried in the desk all the time!"

I'm not saying I'm the best by any means. I'm just saying the job isn't about technical stuff. The technical stuff, you have to know. But the secret to doing it well is good artiste management methods and skills.

Kind regards, Andrew
Mama - The UKs 'all era' Genesis tribute band!
Carillon Video - Professional Wedding Videographer & Wedding Video Production Services in Bolton, Manchester & all over the UK
 
Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Brent Handy said:
Sure, we all strive to improve. But the more you know, the easier life gets.

There are some major, A-level, artists touring with college friends of the band as engineer. Some of these guys are not super stars, and their concerts sound great. Granted, they have the support of an A-1, A-2, A-3. They know the band, the band's music, and that is what got them the gig. So, yes, there are some "super star" engineers, and some of them know how to mix, but they do not always get the gigs. They don't need to.

My point remains. It is not rocket science. It is an art as much as it is anything else, the more you do it, the better you are at it (hopefully) and if you find it hard to do it, then it is not right for you, or you need some more education/experience. That is the point. I am not saying that it is not demanding or sophisticated. It is. The most demanding for me were the HR and PR elements. I was a little too cut and dry, not PC enough, for those elements. Those are things I worked on. Iron sharpens iron, and I got a bunch of iron rubbing me the wrong way occasionally (usually by rookie bands and managers with no clue, no clout, no budget no patience and bouncing checks). But, the older I got, the more I learned what was important and relaxed a bit.
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My overall thoughts on mixing are that "either you have it or you don't". I don't believe that everyone can be brought up to speed within the same amount of hours. Some people don't get it at all, yet to the best of my knowledge excel at what they do in their fields (EE, ME, CE, etc). To me, the "art" part of mixing involves interpretation, learning, practicing and sometimes even perfecting. It's just not for everyone though. A successful mix engineer will have more skills in common with a successful musician than an engineer. The position should be called "mix musician". ;)
 
Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Chris Davis said:
My overall thoughts on mixing are that "either you have it or you don't". I don't believe that everyone can be brought up to speed within the same amount of hours. Some people don't get it at all, yet to the best of my knowledge excel at what they do in their fields (EE, ME, CE, etc). To me, the "art" part of mixing involves interpretation, learning, practicing and sometimes even perfecting. It's just not for everyone though. A successful mix engineer will have more skills in common with a successful musician than an engineer. The position should be called "mix musician". ;)
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Finally this can discussed and not trashed as heresy.
When you are of this mind and a small local provider the value of actual mixing skills is many rungs down on the ladder...at least it appears to me observing and trying to gain clients in that environment. I sold a few events this year by emphatically stressing how important this is to the overall "vibe" of the event. The next band on at a festival goes up feeling good...I would gauge by musicians comments...after hearing the previous act sound produced and effective at reachIng the audience. When they kick in and the stage monitor mix is "the best monitors ever!" I believe they give a better performance...again..hopefully adding to the value.
I have been urging musicians and fans to actively voice their approval of production quality. Event planners, municipal personnel, promoters and agents should be receiving feedback on positive results.
Really, they should hire consultants. Some stuff that happens is just brutal.
Not rocket science but some common sense can't hurt.
 
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Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Uli Behringer said:
Dear all,

here are a few quick updates:

1.) We have just released new firmware 1.07 which provides further improvements.

2.) There will be a more comprehensive manual available beginning of next week.

3.) The S16 Digital Snake is now in pre-production stage. We have planned for mass production in September.

4.) We are now working on a dramatically improved iPad app which will provide much deeper functionality.

Uli​
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Uli thank you for your participation here.

I do a few musicals a year and for my needs a digital console that is reasonably priced like the X32 looks like it would be very usable for these types of shows. But I have been using at least 20-24 wireless body packs as well as area mics (usually around 9) and sometimes I mic the pit band also. So I am looking for something more like an X48.

If you do make such a console please consider a surface with at least 24 input faders and 8 master faders. Also please let the console do decimal point scenes and let me do at least 300 or more scenes. Also you can leave most of the preamps off of the surface and let us use the S16 stage boxes for the preamps. Also please locate the Go (recall next scene) and Back (recall previous scene) buttons down near the bottom of the surface so I can rest my wrist on the console and hit those buttons without having to reach over anything. Or give me GPI connections that are programmable so I cam make my own GO/Back box like I have for the SC48. I am sure that there are more things that would make a board like that theatrical friendly for the lower priced shows that I am doing but those are the big things that come to mind.

I have been using a Behringer BCF2000 when I use the Roland M400 to expand the capabilities and give me some Recall safed faders and I use it as my GO/Back controller.

I have gotten to the point where I wont do a musical theatrical show without a digital console. In the past I have used (we sub rent) a bunch of different consoles including Yamaha PM5DRH, M7cl, Avid/Digidesign SC48, A&H iLive T112, and the Roland M400.
 
Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Dear Kevin,

thanks for your comment.

I fully understand your requirements, however to be able to achieve very aggressive X32 pricing you need extremely high production numbers. As you move into higher channel counts, sales volume substantially decrease.

With the X32 we have developed a very powerful and flexible technology platform which will allow us to easily scale downwards and hence we are now focusing on smaller format consoles which also represent the market sweetspot.

If you need a mixer with high channel counts and also more complex features such as system redundancy, you might want to look at the Midas Pro1 or Pro2 which have become very popular and reasonably priced consoles.

Uli
 
Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Uli Behringer said:
Dear Kevin,

thanks for your comment.

I fully understand your requirements, however to be able to achieve very aggressive X32 pricing you need extremely high production numbers. As you move into higher channel counts, sales volume substantially decrease.

With the X32 we have developed a very powerful and flexible technology platform which will allow us to easily scale downwards and hence we are now focusing on smaller format consoles which also represent the market sweetspot.

If you need a mixer with high channel counts and also more complex features such as system redundancy, you might want to look at the Midas Pro1 or Pro2 which have become very popular and reasonably priced consoles.

Uli
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Thank you, Uli, for answering the question i've been thinking but haven't asked yet. That is, when is the X48/X64 coming out. The answer is clearly never. Which is fine. Now i can plan accordingly. And frankly it makes perfect sense to leave the larger desks to Midas. They've done a few of those over the years. I suspect they know a thing or two about doing that.

Now i'm just pondering how i can use a pair of X32's and a little crafty patching to get the channel count i need. Hmmmm....
 
Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Uli Behringer said:
Dear Kevin,

thanks for your comment.

I fully understand your requirements, however to be able to achieve very aggressive X32 pricing you need extremely high production numbers. As you move into higher channel counts, sales volume substantially decrease.

With the X32 we have developed a very powerful and flexible technology platform which will allow us to easily scale downwards and hence we are now focusing on smaller format consoles which also represent the market sweetspot.

If you need a mixer with high channel counts and also more complex features such as system redundancy, you might want to look at the Midas Pro1 or Pro2 which have become very popular and reasonably priced consoles.

Uli
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Thank you for the quick response. It is nice to know for planning that that is where things are headed.

It looks like (list pricing) of the Pro2 is almost 10 times more expensive then an X32. I was looking at the capabilities of the Pro2 before I heard about the X32. Probably out of the price range the company I do these show with is willing to spend.

Is there any possibility that the X32 will someday be able to handle more then 100 scenes? And is it or will it ever be possible to link together 2 X32 consoles to act as one big 64input console?
 
Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Thank you for all your comments and suggestions.

In the interest of efficiency please allow me to clarify several topics in this one post:

96 kHz

This is a very interesting topic and one which receives plenty of discussion among our various digital engineering teams. Without taking sides in the debate over whether the differences are audible or even necessary in a live sound application, allow me to say that we have made a conscious decision to deliver the X32 with 44.1/48 kHz sample rates. As I have stated before, our goal with the X32 was to deliver a console that meets the real-world needs of the target customer and there are several reasons why that excludes a 96 kHz sample rate.

Most fundamental is the fact that as the sample rate doubles, so does the channel count drop by half. Of course we could add more DSP to maintain the channel count at the higher sample rate, but then the console would likely cost considerably more. Our job is to balance the feature set (channel count) and performance (sample rate) with a cost that makes sense for our customers. While we don’t count it out as a future possibility I would point people to the MIDAS Pro1 as an immediate alternative if they need the higher sample rate.

Why is the X32 so affordable?

This is such an important question because there is a lingering perception that we must somehow be cutting corners to reduce cost. I have seen people claim that we must be using poor quality parts, not following quality control processes or somehow designing in obsolescence. While I can tell you that this is absolutely not the case, it may be best if I offer some insights into our business model to explain.

There are four fundamental elements that comprise the selling price of our products; materials, labor, overhead and profit. Achieving low prices and delivering great value for our customers requires great discipline and hard work in each of these areas. It is my responsibility as the CEO to set the pace and ensure that we reduce costs while always increasing quality; because without quality, we cannot maintain low costs.

We reduce the cost of raw materials in two ways; first, we buy direct from manufacturers and not through a second source, distributor or contract manufacturer. Second, we buy in enormous quantities and leverage this volume in negotiating lower prices. Of course owning the factory where we build our products allows us to cut out at least 30% of the margin demanded by contract manufacturers who are supplying some of our competitors.

Consider that we buy our A/D and D/A converters from Cirrus Logic; the same parts (CS5368 and CS4385) that you will find in a $200k console; we encourage anyone interested to look further into this. We have also been told that we are the single largest Cirrus Logic customer behind only Apple! You will find similar examples with Analog Devices, makers of the SHARC DSPs that we use or Mabuchi, who make the motors for our motor-faders (and those of Penny & Giles, Alps, etc.) and the list goes on. We are buying the very best parts, from the very best manufacturers, direct and in huge quantities. That means we pay the lowest possible prices.

Likewise we have two major ways in which we reduce the cost of labor to build our products. First, we own the factory and this means we are paying workers directly and not through a third party that is making a markup. Again, this results in up to 35% savings. Second, we have invested in massive amount of automation to a far greater extent than many in China in order to reduce cost while increasing quality.

This past year for example we converted the placement of electrolytic capacitors from hand-insertion to full automation. Each of the machines that now place e-caps in rapid-fire succession cost over $500k US so the savings in cost will take some time to be realized. But we have seen an immediate improvement in first-pass yield by eliminating the chance of human error, and that is both improving quality and reducing the cost of re-work.

We run our company with a very low overhead relative to some competitors, and we do this not by cutting corners but rather by working smarter. First off we invest heavily in systems that improve productivity and reduce redundancy. For example our engineering management software Agile talks to our website content management system so when we enter a product’s specifications we do it once and it is automatically replicated across several departments and is immediately posted to the web. Or take our service manuals which are created automatically, in real-time and with the very latest schematics, parts lists and engineering changes - all available through an on-line portal.

Another way we reduce overhead is by re-investing profits in our company to purchase machinery, land and buildings. For example we have purchased new buildings in Manchester, UK and Las Vegas, USA in the past year. We have also purchased land and we are building a $60 million state-of-the-art campus to contain a new factory, research center, logistics hub and residential village in China. These investments not only give us greater control over quality and production but they also reduce our operating costs over the long term.

Finally it is important to know that we operate on what would be considered to be a slim margin by industry standards. While some manufacturers price their products according to what they think the market will accept, we do it very differently. We calculate our costs and add a fair markup that will allow us to continue to grow our business and nothing more. Again, we have all seen strategies where manufacturers release new products at high prices only to reduce them as other competitors come into the market. We prefer to offer a fair price from the beginning and not play such games.

The reality of our company is that we are a highly efficient organization of 3,500 people including over 250 engineers and in-house manufacturing. We build up to 5 million products a year and consequently buy parts at the lowest possible cost. Plus, our quality is among the best in the world, with a defect rate of well under 0.7%, allowing us the confidence to offer a 3-year warranty.

Yes, we are a very different kind of company, we want to be different and I am immensely proud of our team.

X32 Manual

I have been asked why we did not issue a full manual when the console first shipped and when it can be expected to become ready. The truth is that we prepared a full manual and decided at the last moment not to release it as we felt it was too long and too complicated. So we set about rewriting the manual and including more illustrations and less text. The new manual should be posted online in the next couple of days but expect it to expand as we roll out new features and implement updates.

Generation 2 Firmware

Since the X32 has first become available we have received tremendous feedback and many suggestions for new features. While many of these suggestions reflect personal preferences we are open to hearing any and all ideas and promise to consider each of them for future revisions. We are already planning the future addition of dedicated function lockouts, which is one of the suggestions we heard from several of you.

One of the most exciting new features that we are planning for the X32 is the inclusion of high-end FX “plug-ins” based on physical modeling of classic audio hardware. Our algorithm development engineers are essentially “rebuilding” classics from Neve, SSL, UREI and others into effects that will be included on the X32. Well-known and loved gear such as the LA-2A compressor, Lexicon reverbs, an SPL De-Esser and even the TC Finalizer multi-band compressor are on our list.

We are also working on some pretty amazing pitch shifting and pitch correction tools for the X32. Imagine pitch correction on every console and the power of what that will allow you to do in a live or recording environment. The best part is that these effects will be made available as part of a regular firmware update and hence will be free of charge to X32 owners! Our goal is to make the X32 a living platform for constant expansion and improvement.

No company is perfect, but rest assured that all of our people are working very hard to constantly improve your Customer Experience, the quality of our products and service in every possible way.

Allow me to thank you again for all your support in all these 23 years.

Warm regards

Uli
 
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Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Uli Behringer said:
X32 Manual

I have been asked why we did not issue a full manual when the console first shipped and when it can be expected to become ready. The truth is that we prepared a full manual and decided at the last moment not to release it as we felt it was too long and too complicated. So we set about rewriting the manual and including more illustrations and less text. The new manual should be posted online in the next couple of days but expect it to expand as we roll out new features and implement updates.
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How about making the original manual available for those of us who are dyed-in-the-wool techies and like the complex detail information?
 
Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Dear Richard,

our new manual revision is now on-line.

If you feel that you need more information for a certain feature, please let us know.

As mentioned earlier, it is a "living" document as it will grow with the console's expanding features.
 
Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

MUSIC Group Research in Germany Expands

Dear all,

Over the past several months I have come to know many of you by your posts as true experts in pro audio. So when we decided to expand our world-class digital engineering team in Germany - the same team that has developed the X32 - I thought that I would reach out to you. We are currently recruiting for five important positions to join our already established digital mixer team and I am inviting you to spread the word or possibly even make a recommendation - or even apply yourself.

The first position is for two Senior Systems Engineers who will join the digital mixer team. The right person for this role will be fully conversant with modern DSP and FPGA hardware and firmware design, board layout and system troubleshooting and will work closely with the Software team to deliver functional solutions.

http://www.music-group.com/jobs/senior_engineer_systems_de.html

The other open position is for three Senior Software Engineers who will take ownership for all aspects of the design, development and improvement of our state-of-the-art digital audio systems.

http://www.music-group.com/jobs/senior_engineer_software_de.html

These positions will join the team that has been responsible for the X32 Digital Mixer, P16 Personal Monitor System and many other incredible products. They will also be the core of the engineering team that develops future products and systems that will take our digital audio, processing and networking roadmaps forward.

If you are one of the people we're looking for or you know of someone who would be a fit, then please refer them to the following job postings.

Thanks again for all your feedback and warm welcome.

Warm regards

Uli
 
Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Hi Uli
Can I just say 1st of I have NEVER EVER had a problem with your products that I have owned other than the occasional mishap where I mic gets dropped etc I love your guy so thank you very very much for providing in my budget !!!

now then My questions to you is this
what is the rating of your pa speakers I see some that advertise that they are 800watts but is that RMS or PMPO
do you plan to build any speakers that contain horn and two woofers

Many thanks in advance
God Bless
Phil
 
Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Uli Behringer said:
X32 Manual

The truth is that we prepared a full manual and decided at the last moment not to release it as we felt it was too long and too complicated. So we set about rewriting the manual and including more illustrations and less text.
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Hi Uli!

I see from other posts that someone already beat me to the suggestion of releasing the original 'complicated' manual for us technical people to devour. All I would add to that suggestion is, mark it accordingly (technical reference manual?) and release it as a marketing piece for the forum. At the end of the day, your best customers will read everything you release and buy everything you make. Giving them more is positive, not negative. In fact, I bet if you printed it up as a physical manual and stuck a £30.00 price tag on it, people would buy it from your website direct. That's pure profit! :)

My other suggestion is to go one further. You've actively engaged the worldwide user community and I'd say you've been rather successful at that, judging by the replies you're getting. The X32 and indeed your other products will be used in ways you've not thought of and so why don't you leaverage the community by organising a loose team to write an 'open' manual for the X32? It's a complex product and the users will no doubt come up with some significant and interesting ideas. All you have to do is co-ordinate them into a single document and keep it consistent. No disrespect to your engineers and technical authors intended here, but innovation happens automatically in an 'open' and dynamic forum.

If you really need anymore convincing of the power of community, speak to your fellow German, Bernd at Egosoft.

Kind regards, Andrew
Mama - The UKs 'all era' Genesis tribute band!
Carillon Video - Professional Wedding Videographer & Wedding Video Production Services in Bolton, Manchester & all over the UK
 
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Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Andrew Prince said:
<snip>
My other suggestion is to go one further. You've actively engaged the worldwide user community and I'd say you've been rather successful at that, judging by the replies you're getting. The X32 and indeed your other products will be used in ways you've not thought of and so why don't you leaverage the community by organising a loose team to write an 'open' manual for the X32? It's a complex product and the users will no doubt come up with some significant and interesting ideas. All you have to do is co-ordinate them into a single document and keep it consistent. No disrespect to your engineers and technical authors intended here, but innovation happens automatically in an 'open' and dynamic forum.

If you really need anymore convincing of the power of community, speak to your fellow German, Bernd at Egosoft.

Kind regards, Andrew
Mama - The UKs 'all era' Genesis tribute band!
Carillon Video - Professional Wedding Videographer & Wedding Video Production Services in Bolton, Manchester & all over the UK
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or we could just go ahead and set up a website and form a user group with the facilities we want ;)~;-)~:wink:
 
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