Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
Judging by ear, I'd say that the PRX712M is at least 6 dB louder than a Milan M15.
Judging by ear, I'd say that the PRX712M is at least 6 dB louder than a Milan M15.
Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
- Thread starter Bennett Prescott
- Start date
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
I think you're thinking about the X32 Core, not Rack? The Rack doesn't need an S16 and has 23 inputs and 14 outputs - MSRP $1500 plus whatever you want to control it with (laptop and/or iPad plus 5GHz router). If I didn't already have the DL1608 I'd probably buy one.
Typical band I see is a five piece. I normally carry five or six passive monitors on four mixes plus a powered one and a single wireless IEM for the other two mixes (if needed). Even when I was using a MixWiz with only 4 monitor mixes for one band they had seven monitors (they were an eight piece). I'd really recommend five minimum at the Junior Varsity level these days...
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
Add one or four bcf2000, going SAC-style, to get real faders to the setup...
And not to forget either - Since the last software release you can now control the x32-family with a mackie control surface.
Add one or four bcf2000, going SAC-style, to get real faders to the setup...
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
If I can attach here...
View attachment QD_Bar_Rig2006.xls
Not sure if there were ever any older versions but that's dated 2006.
Cheers,
David.
If I can attach here...
View attachment QD_Bar_Rig2006.xls
Not sure if there were ever any older versions but that's dated 2006.
Cheers,
David.
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
I have decided to get a QU-16 to replace my GL2400-16 and outboard rack. I just like the size and features on it, as well as liking A&H for many years.
I typically go out with four of my coaxial wedges-as many point out, it handles a typical 4-5 piece band. I haven't done a prototype, but I've long considered a powered version using one of Brian Oppegard's Speaker Power plate amps. That would make a pretty nice compact monitor with power.
I tend to favor the K12 out of the handful of powered tops I've mixed on, but my main work is with acoustic music more than not.
Subs-well, I would probably roll my own 18" neo driver vented design for a compact, lightweight sub, and again, use some Speaker Power amps, otherwise I agree with Evan, and the powered JBL over the K sub as far as those two are concerned. I do like the small Yorkville too.
Otherwise, My processed PLX amp racks are not bad to lug around. Three of them currently if needed, and they can stack and roll, and with the QU-16, it could all stack and be operated with a pretty small footprint, something I have to contend with at small Irish pubs, and since I'd need that footprint even with powered speakers, the amp racks aren't taking up space I need for other stuff anyway.
Best regards,
John
I have decided to get a QU-16 to replace my GL2400-16 and outboard rack. I just like the size and features on it, as well as liking A&H for many years.
I typically go out with four of my coaxial wedges-as many point out, it handles a typical 4-5 piece band. I haven't done a prototype, but I've long considered a powered version using one of Brian Oppegard's Speaker Power plate amps. That would make a pretty nice compact monitor with power.
I tend to favor the K12 out of the handful of powered tops I've mixed on, but my main work is with acoustic music more than not.
Subs-well, I would probably roll my own 18" neo driver vented design for a compact, lightweight sub, and again, use some Speaker Power amps, otherwise I agree with Evan, and the powered JBL over the K sub as far as those two are concerned. I do like the small Yorkville too.
Otherwise, My processed PLX amp racks are not bad to lug around. Three of them currently if needed, and they can stack and roll, and with the QU-16, it could all stack and be operated with a pretty small footprint, something I have to contend with at small Irish pubs, and since I'd need that footprint even with powered speakers, the amp racks aren't taking up space I need for other stuff anyway.
Best regards,
John
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
Dang, that M15 was a nice box but if it's not gig-worthy...
Dang, that M15 was a nice box but if it's not gig-worthy...
I am not sure what logic took you from statement a to statement b.
It is not like volume is the only consideration when buying a speaker.
For example, a band I work with a lot does 3-4 small shows a week plus 1-2 bigger shows. For the bigger shows a system is always provided. I have actually hauled out my bigger stuff exactly 1 time in the last three years for one of their shows.
For the rest of the smaller shows, they are using a pair of k12s plus 1 ksub. Usually these speakers are idling along at less than 1/2 capacity, because that is what the rooms need. Figuring $100 per show for the equipment investment, this rig took about 3 months of gigging to pay for 3 years ago and have been pure profit since then.
Let me rephrase, the Milan is not gig-worthy FOR ME.
I have a few older PRX boxes that get the job done and occasionally hit the limiter, I want to get more but I'm on the fence about what direction to take in expanding my inventory.
I demo'd the M15 a few days ago and liked the sound but had reservations about getting enough volume in a gig situation, specs say that Max Output for the M15 is 6dB less than the new PRX boxes and Helge affirmed those specs. The M15, while sounding great, does not cover my particular needs.
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Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
I have used the LS801p and LS800 plenty. They are far from my favorite sub. Yes, they are loud, and yes they tend to be road worthy.
However, by the time I attempt to eq the "wooly" sound out of them they have lost some of their output. They are also an absolutely awkward size to deal with, I personally find them harder to move around than some much larger/heavier subs. Maybe that's just me
I would suggest the JBL PRX 618/718XLF or the KW181. IMHO those are the best in that price range.
My 2c
I have used the LS801p and LS800 plenty. They are far from my favorite sub. Yes, they are loud, and yes they tend to be road worthy.
However, by the time I attempt to eq the "wooly" sound out of them they have lost some of their output. They are also an absolutely awkward size to deal with, I personally find them harder to move around than some much larger/heavier subs. Maybe that's just me
I would suggest the JBL PRX 618/718XLF or the KW181. IMHO those are the best in that price range.
My 2c
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
Indeed, one of the hardest things in that market is finding out which box gets loud enough while also holding together. It does me no good to have a box with 6dB more output on paper only to find out it sounds so bad at those levels I wouldn't ever use it. They all have about the same specs anyway, since they're all aimed at each other. I haven't had a chance to listen to the M15, or the new JBL PRX stuff - a casualty of working from a desk most days. That's why I picked a speaker I have heard, and know sounds good at normal levels in a normal sized club, plus think is interesting and new and worth spending extra money on.
Indeed, one of the hardest things in that market is finding out which box gets loud enough while also holding together. It does me no good to have a box with 6dB more output on paper only to find out it sounds so bad at those levels I wouldn't ever use it. They all have about the same specs anyway, since they're all aimed at each other. I haven't had a chance to listen to the M15, or the new JBL PRX stuff - a casualty of working from a desk most days. That's why I picked a speaker I have heard, and know sounds good at normal levels in a normal sized club, plus think is interesting and new and worth spending extra money on.
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
Thanks, David, that's the original! I've updated the copy on my site and attached it here, to include all three versions of the Q&D bar rig.
Thanks, David, that's the original! I've updated the copy on my site and attached it here, to include all three versions of the Q&D bar rig.
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
Let's see, 1/2 capacity, that's 3db down from max output, right?
Let's see, 1/2 capacity, that's 3db down from max output, right?
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
3-4 shows a week!!??
What the heck are they doing?
Do they have a sister in NY?
3-4 shows a week!!??
What the heck are they doing?
Do they have a sister in NY?
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
This is the band I had PMed you about when they were touring up your way. I no longer do many of their smaller shows, but they have 2 residencies a week (every Tuesday and Sunday), typically add another show or two during the week, and are in demand for larger shows on Fridays and Saturdays. In other words they are hustling but are making a decent living as gigging musicians. They are getting ready to go to Fl ending up in Key West for a 5 day run during Fantasy Fest. This is the "gigging reality" that is often missed on these discussion boards but 2 K12's, a Ksub, and a studiolive 16.4.2, and a pair of powered monitors takes them 10 minutes to set up, sounds good, and has been making money consistently for years. And for Drew, I would go to closer to 5 db as being 1/2 capacity, and yes that is where the input sensitivity seems to live for most of these shows (-5 from the unity mark), so whichever scale you are using we are LESS than 1/2 capacity even on the peaks. As a matter of fact, I don't think I have ever seen the limiters flash even momentarily on one of these shows. I have no idea what has happened to the QUICK REPLY but my return no longer works in that window.
This is the band I had PMed you about when they were touring up your way. I no longer do many of their smaller shows, but they have 2 residencies a week (every Tuesday and Sunday), typically add another show or two during the week, and are in demand for larger shows on Fridays and Saturdays. In other words they are hustling but are making a decent living as gigging musicians. They are getting ready to go to Fl ending up in Key West for a 5 day run during Fantasy Fest. This is the "gigging reality" that is often missed on these discussion boards but 2 K12's, a Ksub, and a studiolive 16.4.2, and a pair of powered monitors takes them 10 minutes to set up, sounds good, and has been making money consistently for years. And for Drew, I would go to closer to 5 db as being 1/2 capacity, and yes that is where the input sensitivity seems to live for most of these shows (-5 from the unity mark), so whichever scale you are using we are LESS than 1/2 capacity even on the peaks. As a matter of fact, I don't think I have ever seen the limiters flash even momentarily on one of these shows. I have no idea what has happened to the QUICK REPLY but my return no longer works in that window.
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
My version of that system is a pair of ZXA5's, one KV EX2.2 sub and K10 monitors. Very handy and a very capable system.
My version of that system is a pair of ZXA5's, one KV EX2.2 sub and K10 monitors. Very handy and a very capable system.
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
I have not been closely following the details of this thread. My new options for small FOH are 1 Danley TH 118, 2 OS80's. With amps this should be less than $8K.
I have not been closely following the details of this thread. My new options for small FOH are 1 Danley TH 118, 2 OS80's. With amps this should be less than $8K.
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
For once "The Internet is forever" is a good thing.
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
And the beauty of this rig is that it's compact enough to do the little places, and would handle a 1000+ crowd if you just scale up the TH118's when needed.
And the beauty of this rig is that it's compact enough to do the little places, and would handle a 1000+ crowd if you just scale up the TH118's when needed.
Re: Quick and Dirty Bar Rig 2014 Edition
OS80 | Danley Sound Labs, Inc.
Hmm... 400 watts of "continuous output" ? That would be hella loud. I suspect a wonky spec sheet - that should surely be 400w INPUT. Doesn't anyone proofread their shit anymore <facepalm> ?
OS80 | Danley Sound Labs, Inc.
Hmm... 400 watts of "continuous output" ? That would be hella loud. I suspect a wonky spec sheet - that should surely be 400w INPUT. Doesn't anyone proofread their shit anymore <facepalm> ?