Sound & Stage Power

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Sean Thomas

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Nov 8, 2013
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I'm going to upgrade my power distro. Looking for suggestions and options.

I think (4) Socco x 6 20A circuits ea and (4) 20A Edison's will do what I need.

I have found a box that looks good and they will add a few more Edison's for me. Has anyone used these?

Indu-Electric
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We would run 2 socco to our 2 line array towers and 1 or 2 socco for subs at front/center stage. Edison would be used for MON/FOH and stage power.
Any real-world comments on using Socco for power would be great.

Thanks!
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

Philip LaDue said:
We use Soco for our arrays and subs.
It's so easy to change or custom make breakouts to suit the application.
Click to expand...

Are you running the Soco up to the flybar? If you don't use all 6 circuits, do you run cables back down to be used elsewhere?

I'm trying to think about all option. If I keep the Soco and breakout on the ground, then I have to run 4-6 cables up to the array.
That defeats the puropose a bit.

Should my breakouts be edison or power con? Decisions.....
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

The Socapex-style connectors are a bit more fragile than most of the more common power connectors, and are generally not field-repairable. Additionally, if you are needing 6 single-phase circuits into the mult, you've got 12 current-carrying conductors, and so need to derate your cable ampacity by 50% (2 3-phase circuits only have 6 current-carrying conductors, so only need to derat by 20%). For 2 3-phase circuits, this means either limiting yourself to 15A breakers, or using 10AWG wire (which is not common).

Since Socapex cable is also used prettty extensively for dimmed lighting circuits, you'll probably also want to be careful about labeling cables when working events where lighting is also using multicable.

If you can fit into 3 circuits and will always have 3-phase power available, I'd probably lean towards using L21-20 instead.
 
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Re: Sound & Stage Power

Do you need 6 circuits of power to each tower? Do they need to be separate? If not, a mini-distro at each tower may be a better choice. A 6 circuit 12 gauge SOCO is just as hard to deal with as a piece of 6/4 cable. If you don't need that much total current, going with smaller gauge cable could be an option as well.
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

When we went to powered line arrays I opted to drop 50A CS break out boxes at each tower then ran up a loom for the circuits we needed and used the extra for other things.
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

Sean Thomas said:
I'm going to upgrade my power distro. Looking for suggestions and options.

I think (4) Socco x 6 20A circuits ea and (4) 20A Edison's will do what I need.

I have found a box that looks good and they will add a few more Edison's for me. Has anyone used these?

Indu-Electric
View attachment 11824View attachment 11825

We would run 2 socco to our 2 line array towers and 1 or 2 socco for subs at front/center stage. Edison would be used for MON/FOH and stage power.
Any real-world comments on using Socco for power would be great.

Thanks!
Click to expand...

If you have universal supplies on your amps/speakers you can run the arrays at 208v and lose that pesky noise carrying neutral as well as having twice the current capability for future growth as your array at 208 will draw half the current than at 110.
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

Chris Greco said:
If you have universal supplies on your amps/speakers you can run the arrays at 208v and lose that pesky noise carrying neutral as well as having twice the current capability for future growth as your array at 208 will draw half the current than at 110.
Click to expand...

Not quite. If you have 3x 2kW loads that you can connect either line-neutral or line-line on a 3-phase circuit, the current in each phase is the same.

When the loads are connected line-neutral, you are loading each phase with 2kW (~16A at 120V), and the neutral provides the return path. Because the current flowing in the neutral from each phase is also ~16A, but the phases are 120 degrees apart, the sum of the current in the neutral is zero (16A at 0 degrees plus 16A at 120 degrees plus 16A at 240 degrees). (This assumes resisitive loads)

When the loads are connected line-line, you are still loading each phase with 2kW (~10A at 208V), but the adjacent phase now provides the return path. When you actually work out the values for the line currents, you find that they are identical for both Y and delta connected loads.

In short, TANSTAAFL
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

Thanks for the info. I will certainly think about running 6/4 50A sub box over to the arrays and make a loom to go up. Again, so many options.
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

Sean Thomas said:
Thanks for the info. I will certainly think about running 6/4 50A sub box over to the arrays and make a loom to go up. Again, so many options.
Click to expand...

WDoes this distribution system need to support other inventory? How does it work going forward?

There aren't really any good or bad ways (so long as you're up to Code, etc), it's what works best for you, your staff, and your gear.
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

Tim McCulloch said:
Does this distribution system need to support other inventory? How does it work going forward?

There aren't really any good or bad ways (so long as you're up to Code, etc), it's what works best for you, your staff, and your gear.
Click to expand...

And your region. There is some wisdom to using the same distro scheme as companies you may cross-rent from/to.
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

I was told that Soca has more cross rent potential. If I needed more footage, it would be easier for me to rent.
I agree, there is no right or wrong, I just want to think through all the options.
 
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Re: Sound & Stage Power

Sean Thomas said:
I was told that Soca has more cross rent potential. If I needed more footage, it would be easier for me to rent.
I agree, there is no right or wrong, I just want to think through all the options.
Click to expand...

Remember theirs no single standard for Soco wiring, some have grounding rings and some don't. Could be an issue depending on your use.

Rob ,

Thanks for clarifying. Never thought of it that way but I have now been enlightened.

Chris
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

Sean Thomas said:
I was told that Soca has more cross rent potential. If I needed more footage, it would be easier for me to rent.
I agree, there is no right or wrong, I just want to think through all the options.
Click to expand...

This is one of the reasons I suggested seeing what's usd by other local companies

California cable (the most common type for 50A split phase) is very widely available from places that rent temporary power (generators), as that's the midsize cable they normally use (sitting between camlok and edison). Camlock is also pretty widely available, but is likely overkill for what you want.

Socapex can be sourced from lighting suppliers, but isn't as common on the audio side of things.

Within the entertainment industry, there tend to be regional standards.
In one area I've worked, L21-30 was the regional standard for power distribuiton, and every local shop had plenty of it; in another part of the country, L21-20 was the standard and easily available. L21-30 was practically unused in that part of the country.
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

Ok guys, I am about 95% sure I'm switching consideration from Soca to CS50 cables and break out boxes for my 2 array towers and center sub power locations. Generators use the CS50 and many audio companies in Nashville have the CS50 cables and break out boxes. I like that I can make and fix those cables, don't want to mess with 19 pin Soca.

I've seen 6 Edison break out boxes that take a 50A CS50 feed, but DO NOT have individual 20A breakers for those 6 cirsuits. IS that an issue or problem? Can you run a 6X20A = 120A potential on a CS50 cable and 50A 2 pole main breaker?

Thanks again!
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

I've seen 6 Edison break out boxes that take a 50A CS50 feed, but DO NOT have individual 20A breakers for those 6 cirsuits. IS that an issue or problem? Can you run a 6X20A = 120A potential on a CS50 cable and 50A 2 pole main breaker?

Motion labs
 

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Re: Sound & Stage Power

Sean Thomas said:
I've seen 6 Edison break out boxes that take a 50A CS50 feed, but DO NOT have individual 20A breakers for those 6 cirsuits. IS that an issue or problem? Can you run a 6X20A = 120A potential on a CS50 cable and 50A 2 pole main breaker?
Click to expand...

That's absolutely a problem, unless you like your power cables acting like fuses.

There are plenty of off-the-shelf solutions for distros that take the CS 50A connector and break it out into 6 individually breakered circuits. These include
Motion Labs
Lex Products
Hubbell
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

Shane Presley said:
I've seen 6 Edison break out boxes that take a 50A CS50 feed, but DO NOT have individual 20A breakers for those 6 cirsuits. IS that an issue or problem? Can you run a 6X20A = 120A potential on a CS50 cable and 50A 2 pole main breaker?

Motion labs
Click to expand...

The Motion Labs racpac you illustrated does have breakers for the six circuits. As to how many circuits you can run on a 50a service, as long as there is a 50a main breaker or fuse protecting the feeder that will limit the amount you can draw. So you don't actually have "120a potential".
 
Re: Sound & Stage Power

So is this a benifit of a Soca cable run, since each of the 6 circuits has a breaker on the main distro, you don't need another breaker box system at the line array? This makes the CS50 route much more expensive.
 
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