So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Kip Conner said:
Wow, you can tell a lot about the console from looking at their editors.... this is some serious improvements for Yamaha. 24 rack virtual spaces? Stupendous!
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I'm not sure how you get the figure of 24? There are 2 x 8 GEQs, 1 x 8 regular FX rack spaces and 8 x Premium Rack spaces so that would 32. And the VCM effects in both the "regular" and Premium racks can function as Stereo or Dual Mono, so you can have 16 channels of each if you need.
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Justice C. Bigler said:
...ummm....unless I'm mistaken, I think one of the display indicators for the led buttons for each channel was comp/gate. I'd have to check the reference manual to be sure, but it seems like I remember that.
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I don't think so. Had a CL5 hands-on today and there was no indication of comp/gate activity.

Overall, there were some things I liked:

1. everyone who ever worked on a M7CL can walk up to the desk and basically operate it.
2. flexible user fader layers plus intuitive assignment
3. the racks
4. Dante, network based concept

Things I didn't like:

1. some ways of navigating around the desk are too M7CL for my taste (which is because of the number one "i like" reason, I think)
- still the GEQ and FX are way too far away for editing.
- DCA assignment could be faster / more intuitive.
- naming of channels/DCAs/mixes would be greatly improved by the possibility of having a keyboard at the desk
2. only one user layer in the middle, centralogic, bank. So the number of user layers is not consistent. The input/output switch in the centralogic bank is not intuitive.
- no way of switching the HPF on without the touchscreen
3. the racks are still managed like on the M7CL. This is getting harder because of the sheer number of inserts and FX. So I would end up using up a lot of UDKs (only 16 on that desk)
- still only one cue bus. This is very disappointing for monitors, when mixing ears and wedges I really need flexibility when cueing signals.
- silly fader caps
- strange missing effects in the FX library (when choosing an effect by the picture there is a mono delay, but not in the library)

Bottom line: More features, still no good management of these features.

Overall it's an improved M7CL, still feels like the original M7CL. So very mixed feelings...

Let's see how my first real mix on a CL works out.

And I wonder when Yamaha brings their PM5D replacement / upgrade.
 
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Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Christian Tepfer said:
Things I didn't like:

1. some ways of navigating around the desk are too M7CL for my taste (which is because of the number one "i like" reason, I think)
- still the GEQ and FX are way too far away for editing.
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It sounds like you weren't introduced to the new insert-button? There's a new button in the insert-field of the channel view screen that takes you directly to the control page of whatever effect (GEQ/FX/Premium) is inserted on that channel. That's pretty quick and easy, I would say.
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Frederik Rosenkjær said:
It sounds like you weren't introduced to the new insert-button? There's a new button in the insert-field of the channel view screen that takes you directly to the control page of whatever effect (GEQ/FX/Premium) is inserted on that channel. That's pretty quick and easy, I would say.
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That sounds like an improvement. Thank you for the hint, I will look for that button. On the main touchscreen, yes? That means I still have to look at and touch the main touch screen, but much better than clumsy navigating or using up a lot of UDKs.
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

John O'Brien said:
Can anyone give an honest opinion about how they sound, sonically? I may be missing that here on the forum, but I haven't seen that yet.
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Maybe the 2 people who have done a real show with them aren't on Internet forums.

Mac
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Helge Dr. Bentsen said:
I've done one show on a CL5 and can't say I noticed any sound quality issues with it. I'd say that the sources on stage came out of the PA sounding like I expected them to do, AKA no artificial coloration from the desk.
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WHHATT!!!??? You mean they don't have that warm analog distortion that makes them sound oh so much more musical? Blasphemy, I say, BLASPHEMY!!!
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

John O'Brien said:
Can anyone give an honest opinion about how they sound, sonically? I may be missing that here on the forum, but I haven't seen that yet.
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I got a few hours hands on at a workshop the week after Infocomm. It was the normal Yamaha training format where there were about half dozen desks, each with their own tracks coming into the desk. They sound fine. It's not an XL4 or Cadac but it's not at that price point either. I'd use one if the situation was appropriate. Definitely a couple of steps up from the M7.
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

mackerr said:
Maybe the 2 people who have done a real show with them aren't on Internet forums.

Mac
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By Sunday night I will be the 3rd one with a real show on a CL. It will be a brass band, a chamber orchestra and a rock/pop group. A pretty good "test setup" I would say. Looking forward to that one.

In general, I found the sonic performance of a desk itself is not a very big contributor to overall sound quality. For me it's the features and the user interface that make up the "desk sound".

And I will definitely try out the "insert" button.
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Do dealers have prices yet? Last I bothered my dealers they still didn't have anything except MSRP but that was a while ago. At Infocomm the Yamaha guys were saying the same thing.

Thanks,

Philip
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Philip Roberts said:
Do dealers have prices yet?
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Those that are set up with Yamaha as authorized retailers for the CL line should have prices by now. Not every Yamaha dealer will have access to this product line right away. I got prices from four different vendors last week with their bid packages, so I would say yes, they have prices.
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Christian Tepfer said:
By Sunday night I will be the 3rd one with a real show on a CL. It will be a brass band, a chamber orchestra and a rock/pop group. A pretty good "test setup" I would say. Looking forward to that one.

In general, I found the sonic performance of a desk itself is not a very big contributor to overall sound quality. For me it's the features and the user interface that make up the "desk sound".

And I will definitely try out the "insert" button.
Click to expand...

So this was my first real mixing job on the CL5:

Easy setup, as I was taking over a gig that started yesterday. Made some user fader layers, prepared channels etc.

1. the brass band went on with no reinforcement, time for me to play with the desk even more. I created a band environment and the chamber orchestra setup.

2. by the time of changeover power went out. No disturbing sound out of the speakers, as expected. Actually, half of the place was without power, so no more coffee. It took some time to restore power, the conductor decided to start without reinforcement as well. As soon as I got power again, I told the conductor and we decided to gently pull up the orchestra level. I could get a mix together really fast, loved the assignable encoders for gain and hpf. It was just 12 channels, after all but definitely faster than on a M7CL, on par with a PM5D.

3. the band turned out to be really relaxed, slim and tight acoustic setup. Fast soundcheck here as well. Time for a little rant:

Why on earth am I not able to use the assignable encoder for gain when I'm in the sends on faders mode? This makes no sense at all.

rant over.

Regarding the insert button: yes but no, it's not really helpful for my workflow.

Bottom line:

The CL5 is the M7 I wished for in the first place, good improvements were made. In my eyes it's still a CL desk, with the upside of getting used to it fast and the downside of the same basic user interface of the M7CL.
 
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