So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Andrew Broughton said:
I'm hoping for a lot more granularity in safing mixes, but I'm not expecting anything. Yamaha has a long way to go in terms of Scene Management.
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It seems those prayers are being heard to some extent at least. Like I said the Recall Safe-department is being expanded, but also the Scene Focus area, which I'm very happy to see - it seems that focus can now be specified by individual channels, and even individual parameters for individual channels, as far as I can gather from this video:

YAMAHA CL Prolight & Sound 2012 - YouTube
 
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Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

One question I have now, and I'm afraid to hear the answer:

Will it be possible to daisy chain more than one VCM FX (both Premium and "normal") on a given channel or bus?
Judging from the block diagram and from the LS9 and M7, I would think not, but then again now that they've built all this in, and spend a lot of time on it in the presentations, I can't believe they wouldn't have thought of it?

Anyone know?
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

So I can't believe we are 5 pages into this thread and nobody has really asked the important question yet.....
Every article I read online talks about sonics and how good the "premium rack" and effects are...

Has anyone heard anything about the Mic Pres? The thing that scares me in the video mentioned above, the Yamaha Rep says the Mic pre's are a mixture of PM5D and M7.... I sure hope the CL series doesn't sound like a 5D running at 48k....

YAMAHA CL Prolight & Sound 2012 - YouTube

I just did 2 weeks on a Pro9.... Midas doesn't ever talk about how good their effects are (in fact they are crap, everyone uses outboard)... Midas spent their time on the Mic Pres... Who needs Plugins when the console's channel strip just sounds awesome! I do realise that its unfair to compare the Pro 9 to the CL5 because the Pro 9 is almost triple the price....

We know the usability will be awesome, we know the effects will be ok, sure having a fancy compressor for a few difficult channels will be helpful... But I'd LOVE to find out the CL Series will be the first Yamaha Digital console (besides the 5D at 96k) to actually have top end...I just want good Pre Amps!
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Reid Wall said:
So I can't believe we are 5 pages into this thread and nobody has really asked the important question yet.....
Every article I read online talks about sonics and how good the "premium rack" and effects are...

Has anyone heard anything about the Mic Pres? The thing that scares me in the video mentioned above, the Yamaha Rep says the Mic pre's are a mixture of PM5D and M7.... I sure hope the CL series doesn't sound like a 5D running at 48k....

YAMAHA CL Prolight & Sound 2012 - YouTube

I just did 2 weeks on a Pro9.... Midas doesn't ever talk about how good their effects are (in fact they are crap, everyone uses outboard)... Midas spent their time on the Mic Pres... Who needs Plugins when the console's channel strip just sounds awesome! I do realise that its unfair to compare the Pro 9 to the CL5 because the Pro 9 is almost triple the price....

We know the usability will be awesome, we know the effects will be ok, sure having a fancy compressor for a few difficult channels will be helpful... But I'd LOVE to find out the CL Series will be the first Yamaha Digital console (besides the 5D at 96k) to actually have top end...I just want good Pre Amps!
Click to expand...

Edited: Should have looked closer. Rupert Neve designed eq and compressor plugins, not the pres: Rupert Neve & VCM Technology : Yamaha Digital Mixing Console CL Series - YouTube
 
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Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Reid Wall said:
We know the usability will be awesome, we know the effects will be ok, sure having a fancy compressor for a few difficult channels will be helpful... But I'd LOVE to find out the CL Series will be the first Yamaha Digital console (besides the 5D at 96k) to actually have top end...I just want good Pre Amps!
Click to expand...

Well, time will tell, and if you don't like them - just use somehing else? Rocknet integrates beautifully and sounds awesome. And now you don't have to pay for built-in pres you might not use (well, 8, but still....).

How hot do you normally run the Yamaha preamps (just a small survey I'm doing out of curiosity). Do you know f.inst. what gain a normal SM/Beta58 ends up at when you're behind the console? Do you pay attention to not be on the bad side of the PAD-gaps (especially between -13 and -14 Yamaha gain figure)?

Actually he says that they have elements of both M7 og 5D, but are new.
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Frederik Rosenkjær said:
Well, time will tell, and if you don't like them - just use somehing else? Rocknet integrates beautifully and sounds awesome. And now you don't have to pay for built-in pres you might not use (well, 8, but still....).

How hot do you normally run the Yamaha preamps (just a small survey I'm doing out of curiosity). Do you know f.inst. what gain a normal SM/Beta58 ends up at when you're behind the console? Do you pay attention to not be on the bad side of the PAD-gaps (especially between -13 and -14 Yamaha gain figure)?

Actually he says that they have elements of both M7 og 5D, but are new.
Click to expand...

Anytime I mix on any digital console (M7, 5D, LS9, Midas Pro, Venue etc) I always run my Pre-Amps into the orange, and then attenuate (each console has a different term for it) back to suit gain structure....

I really hope it sounds great.... That would be really good news! Yamaha consoles are always the easiest to use and the fastest to get around, especially for mixing a bunch of in ear monitors.....
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

I'm also keen to hear how the pre amps stack up.

Also, does anyone know if it will be possible to run a Rio rack with Editor (and/or StageMix) but no console?
I love this feature with the iLive system.
We can have several small churches using an iDR16 + Editor and iPad, and then pull them all together and add the T112 console for a big event.

Dante built in is fantastic and would suit us really well if we can use a Rio without the console!!

Thanks,
Josh
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Joshua Hughes said:
I'm also keen to hear how the pre amps stack up.

Also, does anyone know if it will be possible to run a Rio rack with Editor (and/or StageMix) but no console?
I love this feature with the iLive system.
We can have several small churches using an iDR16 + Editor and iPad, and then pull them all together and add the T112 console for a big event.

Dante built in is fantastic and would suit us really well if we can use a Rio without the console!!

Thanks,
Josh
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It will not or at least not using CL Editor or StageMix. Dante is just an audio transport. The reason why it works on iLlive is that the processing is in the rack unit. On the CL series the processing is in the console.

You should, however, be able to get audio back and forth to a laptop, and so you should be able to mix a show in a DAW like Cubase or Reaper. I can't tell you what to do, but I don't think I would go there, other than for laughs or emergencies.
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

I got to play with the consoles yesterday, and was pretty impressed. If you have used an M7, you can walk up and use this console. Also, the console actually looked smaller than I thought it would. I was thinking like Soundcraft Vi series size, but it just as small as a M7-32 channel, of course slightly taller. The preamps are completely new design. We got to listen to some playback through the new NEXO wedges. The custom layers are quick to assign. Assigning the layers were as easy as doing mute groups and DCAs in 'Channel Job' on a M7. The 3 cards slots on all 3 size consoles was a plus too. Studio manager is not used for this console. CL Editor looks exactly the same as SM but is easier to connect. There are no more Network MIDI drivers to setup to get working. CL Editor just needs the IP address and loads it up. We were told that that the CL1 (which we were looking at getting) with the bigger stage rack will be around $21,000.

CL Photo.jpg
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Tony Williams said:
The custom layers are quick to assign. Assigning the layers were as easy as doing mute groups and DCAs in 'Channel Job' on a M7.
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I would have loved them to be assignable in the way it can be done on the LS9, but as far as I was told and could see at Frankfurt, it doesn't work that way.

I'm talking about the method where you can select a fader in the Custom Fader Layer, and then select a channel on one of the "regular" layers, and the select channel will be assigned to the aforementioned selected fader. I could see this working particularly well on the CL-consoles, given the split fader banks - then you could have the Custom Fader Bank on whatever fader bank you are wanting to set up, and on the other one you could have you pool of channels and DCA you wish to assign. Then it would just be selecting back and forth between the left and right hand: "I would like this fader to carry this channel, and this fader to carry this bus" (pressing with left and right hand alternatively) and so forth.
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Lionel Miller said:
Looking forward to getting a demo on this desk.

Shame that it doesn't have two cue busses.
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I'm guessing you want to use it at monitors so you can have an IEM Transmitter and a cue wedge?
The m7 only has one cue bus, but to get around this:

In outport setup patch your monitor bus to an option card as "cascade cue", and patch your wedge as Monitor. The monitor knob on the surface is your cue wedge and the IEM transmitter stays at unity.

Im sure the CL will do something similar.....
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

Reid Wall said:
I'm guessing you want to use it at monitors so you can have an IEM Transmitter and a cue wedge?
The m7 only has one cue bus, but to get around this:

In outport setup patch your monitor bus to an option card as "cascade cue", and patch your wedge as Monitor. The monitor knob on the surface is your cue wedge and the IEM transmitter stays at unity.

Im sure the CL will do something similar.....
Click to expand...

Correct. It is a shame they didn't include it when the Midas, Digico and Soundcraft options all have it.

I've been doing it using the insert returns on the LR and Mono busses on M7's so will continue like that I guess.
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

I have a quiz about the CL series.

What do you notice that is different between it and the PM5D and M7CL and why is it important?


PM5D:

Z_Input_PM5D.png
M7CL:

Z_Input_M7CL.png
CL:

Z_Input_CL.png​
 
Re: So we get new Yamaha desks? CL series

a) Gain ranges go from - to +, unlike everyother digital gain on yamahas desks from + to -.
b) Different input gain right out of the batt (ie, software value 0 [up from +10 on M7/5D, up from -10 on CL] is not the same between the CL and the rest) to make for some possibly interesting show conversions.
c) Differing input load impedances from +18 to +17.
d) No input sensitivity figures
e) No talkback spec (?if there is one?)
f) Something else I didn't see in the quick glance .....
 
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