Infocomm???

Re: Infocomm???

John Roberts said:
I already said to ignore the 99%, but it does seem like somebody would notice and say something to somebody.

I guess people are accustomed to sub-standard sound in such venues.

My point is not to take every complaint as serious, but if 10 people say the HF is weak, maybe check the preset. You could diagnose it from miles away, perhaps a human operator could too.

JR

PS: Even the best system will not overcome being operated incorrectly. We see this often enough.
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And in this case the client wanted a preset that guaranteed substandard performance. The client is always right, especially when they're wrong. Hmm, where have I heard that before?
 
Re: Infocomm???

Tim McCulloch said:
And in this case the client wanted a preset that guaranteed substandard performance. The client is always right, especially when they're wrong. Hmm, where have I heard that before?
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Which raises the old question, who is the customer***? The meat in seats think they are customers.

If the control room is not in the direct sound field, how hard is it to throw a mic, out in the sound field to monitor the actual output? Maybe not in the end zone, but I suspect they could have caught this error pretty easily.

JR

**** The customer for any transaction is the one who pays you.
 
Re: Infocomm???

Tim McCulloch said:
And in this case the client wanted a preset that guaranteed substandard performance. The client is always right, especially when they're wrong. Hmm, where have I heard that before?
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It wasn't that they requested sub standard performance. Without going into details-here is a little information.

For PRACTICE-they wanted a system to just cover the field-so a single J3 was used. Then they wanted a little more low freq-so since there were 12x18" drivers in the Caleb-the upper freq of the Caleb were muted for this usage.

Somehow the muted part of the Caleb got saved into the full system preset-which was used for the game.

I don't know all the details, but that is the "jist" of it.

Let's just call it a "programming error". When you have different presets built of something, sometimes you miss things-I know-I have done it myself "OOPS-I forgot to turn that back on in the preset"---------
 
Re: Infocomm???

Hello

Since this thread has already derailed from original track - here is photo I found on news today - it is said to be South Korean propaganda loudspeaker. Directivity? Lobing? Response? Fidelity? :blush:

Here is a fantastic marketing area for Danley - send one Jericho to North Korea for free for testing and make option to buy hundred at right price :lol:

Ooops - forgot they hate americans - never mind - make the same deal with South Korea 8)~8-)~:cool:


By the way - pay attention of the construction - looks like it is scalable by bolting more parts together - one little horn for fist fight - four in barfight - nine for marketplace riot etc. Different shapes can be achieved ...



They tell, that in war between Finland and Russia, the russians had loudspeakers and they tried to get finns fooled by yelling : " Finns - we have bread, come to eat."
According to tales the finns responded : " We have butter to spread on it, come and get it."


15_8%20Etel%C3%A4-Korea%20kaiuttimet%2052113264.jpg
 
Re: Infocomm???

Timo Ulkuniemi said:
Hello


Here is a fantastic marketing area for Danley - send one Jericho to North Korea for free for testing and make option to buy hundred at right price :lol:
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There is actually quite a bit of Danley in Korea-and the local guys do quite a bit of marketing. In fact one year they brought us nice polo shirts :)

If there was a market for that-I bet they would pick up on it.

Good idea though.

You can't just keep piling speakers together and expect it to get louder and better
 
Re: Infocomm???

Timo Ulkuniemi said:
Hello


They tell, that in war between Finland and Russia, the russians had loudspeakers and they tried to get finns fooled by yelling : " Finns - we have bread, come to eat."
According to tales the finns responded : " We have butter to spread on it, come and get it."
Click to expand...

Some where in my father's old papers I have pictures of WWII aircraft outfitted with PA speakers. After the war ended there were still soldiers hiding in the south pacific, so the plane attempted to coax them out of hiding, and inform them the war was over.

Maybe i'll dig it out and scan in a picture later.

JR

====its later=======

pictures didn't come over so I put them in a new post below

JR
 
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Re: Infocomm???

I don't see the pictures so I will try again.


Fist pix is of the speaker. From the article they state SPL of 131 db (article used little b but Bell hadn't been dead that long at the time) on axis 30 feet from the speaker with the energy radiated over a 40' cone.

second pix is of the amps 4x500W amps (driving 4 segments of speakers) from a wire recorder.

Expected usable speech intelligibility at 10,000 feet so they can fly higher than machine gun fire.

Two miles is decent throw, but keep in mind just for speech frequencies so not a real threat for Ivan's "Longest speaker throw" competition. :-)

JR
 

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Re: Infocomm???

John Roberts said:
I don't see the pictures so I will try again.


Fist pix is of the speaker. From the article they state SPL of 131 db (article used little b but Bell hadn't been dead that long at the time) on axis 30 feet from the speaker with the energy radiated over a 40' cone.

second pix is of the amps 4x500W amps (driving 4 segments of speakers) from a wire recorder.

Expected usable speech intelligibility at 10,000 feet so they can fly higher than machine gun fire.

Two miles is decent throw, but keep in mind just for speech frequencies so not a real threat for Ivan's "Longest speaker throw" competition. :-)

JR
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500 watts was A HUGE amount of power back then. I suspect most "normal" amps were on the order of 5 or 10 watts.

But this WAS the military-and they have a "different budget" than others.

The speaker would "back calculate" to a max output of 150dB @1M.

Again-quite a lot back then.

Thanks for sharing :) I love old interesting technologies.
 
Re: Infocomm???

I wanna know how many guys came running out to the beach waving their shirts yelling " about effin time now pick me the hell up!"

John Roberts said:
Some where in my father's old papers I have pictures of WWII aircraft outfitted with PA speakers. After the war ended there were still soldiers hiding in the south pacific, so the plane attempted to coax them out of hiding, and inform them the war was over.

Maybe i'll dig it out and scan in a picture later.

JR

====its later=======

pictures didn't come over so I put them in a new post below

JR
Click to expand...
 
Re: Infocomm???

I remember my dad telling me of a device called a beachmaster. It was a construction compressor hooked up to a horn. Inside the throat was a valve that was controlled by a voice coil. It made for loud noises and could do speech. Distorted but very loud. Never did get to see one.
 
Re: Infocomm???

Riley Casey said:
I wanna know how many guys came running out to the beach waving their shirts yelling " about effin time now pick me the hell up!"
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I remember hearing stories of old guys found on islands, that didn't know the war had been over for decades.
Don't know if these were true, or legends.
 
Re: Infocomm???

Glenn Adams said:
I remember my dad telling me of a device called a beachmaster. It was a construction compressor hooked up to a horn. Inside the throat was a valve that was controlled by a voice coil. It made for loud noises and could do speech. Distorted but very loud. Never did get to see one.
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Also known as an "Auxetophone".

The story of the Japanese soldier who'd stayed in hiding for decades past the war is true. They had to find his old commanding officer to go meet him and officially change his orders before he returned.
 
Re: Infocomm???

Jack Arnott said:
I remember hearing stories of old guys found on islands, that didn't know the war had been over for decades.
Don't know if these were true, or legends.
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As far as I know there are legit stories of people turning up right after the turn of the century!

If they never got the message or thought JR's planes were just propaganda, I don't know.
 
Re: Infocomm???

Those particular loudspeaker are in part responsible for pushing North and South Korea to the brink of war as we have been posting!

http://news.yahoo.com/korea-us-brace-n-korea-deadline-tension-mounts-051323500.html#

"The first round of the talks started shortly after a deadline set by North Korea for the South to dismantle loudspeakers broadcasting anti-North Korean propaganda at their border. North Korea had declared that its front-line troops were in full war readiness and prepared to go to battle if Seoul did not back down."

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/08/22/asia/koreas-tensions/

"South Korea's pro-democracy broadcasts, via loud speakers across the border with the North, restarted after the two South Korean soldiers were wounded by landmines."
 
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Re: Infocomm???

Ivan Beaver said:
I have a feeling by the end of this decade (around 2020 or 2021) things will start to change and people will start to realize that they have been "deceived" and new (actually old) ideas will start to be more popular.

But "line arrays" will be with us for awhile. My guess (based on historically how long it takes to change opinions/ideas) is that by 2030, the "line array" fad will have run its course. But the loudspeaker driver manufacturers DO NOT want this to happen. They are LOVING being able to sell more drivers to do the same job as fewer drivers-simply good business.

By then I will be a "crusty 'ol fart" and will be able to look back and laugh at what happened the previous 20 years.
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Isn't the boss of this web site in the loudspeaker driver business?
Are you dissing the boss? Taking on the head cheese?
Biting the hand that feeds us? Quite bold.
 
Re: Infocomm???

Jack Arnott said:
Isn't the boss of this web site in the loudspeaker driver business?
Are you dissing the boss? Taking on the head cheese?
Biting the hand that feeds us? Quite bold.
Click to expand...

666 posts, evil dude...:-(

The problem with that premise is ASSuming that the driver manufacturers have any influence with the buying public.

The newcomer always has to overcome the market perceptions of what is SOTA. Line arrays gained traction because they did a better job of "putting heat on the seats" steering where the SPL landed in the audience. Sound quality was and is still debatable.

BTW line arrays also have a cool factor where they look impressive. Don't discount how things look in such purchase decisions.

I expect the market to figure it out eventually but it can take time, some hifi guys still swear by tube amps and play vinyl recordings.

JR
 
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