Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

Re: Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

TJ Cornish said:
I haven't seen the 5DS in person yet, either, but enhanced video is not one of its features. It's arguably worse for video than the 5DIII - no clean HDMI out, no headphone jack. Canon has been pretty clear that this camera is for high-res studio and landscape use. Their thinking is that the target market doesn't care about video. It will do 1080P video, but it's not a main feature, and no 4K (that's the other thing people are screaming at Canon about). The presumably forthcoming 5DIV will likely be more mainstream focused, possibly including 4K video at the expense of lower still resolution. Or not. We'll see.
Click to expand...

Odd, all the buzz I keep reading about is photography through frame capture. I would think the medium format market would be hard to break into for Canon, but who knows. I hope someone I know gets one so I can go play with it. Canon's large pixel count sensors have had a bad rap over the years, but I've never tried out or even seen the raw output from a digital medium format camera before.

At 8-10kUSD entry price, that is outside my hobby budget ;-) That's like the sum of all my camera bodies and lenses combined, spread over many years! Someone else mentioned gear-acquisition-syndrome. Amateur DSLR photography is bad enough, then add my addiction to buying broken test equipment and microwave radio parts. Oh god, and I started working on a laser project too. I've tried to stay away from lasers, because I knew once I got started on optical stuff it would be a big problem for my checking account.
 
Last edited:
Re: Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

TJ Cornish said:
Wow - I didn't know my camera sucked until the Internet told me.
Click to expand...

Virtually all modern cameras can take technically excellent photos, and with interchangable lens cameras, the weak point technically is typically the lens.

That said, if you really want to learn how to use a camera to its fullest potential, I suggest buying a manual film camera and several rolls of slide film.
 
Re: Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

Mark DeArman said:
Odd, all the buzz I keep reading about is photography through frame capture. I would think the medium format market would be hard to break into for Canon, but who knows. I hope someone I know gets one so I can go play with it. Canon's large pixel count sensors have had a bad rap over the years, but I've never tried out or even seen the raw output from a digital medium format camera before.

At 8-10kUSD entry price, that is outside my hobby budget ;-) That's like the sum of all my camera bodies and lenses combined, spread over many years! Someone else mentioned gear-acquisition-syndrome. Amateur DSLR photography is bad enough, then add my addiction to buying broken test equipment and microwave radio parts. Oh god, and I started working on a laser project too. I've tried to stay away from lasers, because I knew once I got started on optical stuff it would be a big problem for my checking account.
Click to expand...

4K cameras are typically 8-12 megapixel sensors. Canon announced their new XC-10 which does actually that- you can extract 8 megapixel stills from 4K video. The 50 megapixels of the 5DS require quite a bit of number crunching - it takes two DIGIC processors to barely make 5 frames per second.

The medium format market is all of about 6,000 units per year. Canon will almost certainly outsell the entire MF market with a month or two worth of 5DS sales. In certain circumstances, the 5DS is absolutely comparable with medium format. In others, perhaps not so much. It will be interesting to see how this and future high-res DSLRs affect the future of photography.

As to $8000 - $10,000 - that is medium format land. The 5DS body is $3700, and you can get several great lenses before getting to $8K. It's probably outside my budget too, but that may or may not stop me. :) I've talked myself out of the 5DIII; I'll either jump on the 5DS or wait for the 5DIV.
 
Re: Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

TJ Cornish said:
The medium format market is all of about 6,000 units per year. Canon will almost certainly outsell the entire MF market with a month or two worth of 5DS sales. In certain circumstances, the 5DS is absolutely comparable with medium format. In others, perhaps not so much. It will be interesting to see how this and future high-res DSLRs affect the future of photography.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I didn't see if they had posted test results for stops of contrast yet. I think the new CMOS medium format sensors are like 12 or something on the the entry level Pentax I saw in Popular Photography. I'm not sure sure how the sensor sizes compare, I'll have to do some more reading. I know almost nothing about that market.

I guess your right, the processing power required to do even 20MP would make the thing unusable on battery and probably size prohibitive. It's too bad there isn't more data available on these custom ASICs for comparison with like a commercial off the shelf Analog TS-201 or TI Keystone. It's funny by comparison how low our data rates typically are in audio. Computers and interconnects have got so fast I rarely even think about it anymore when processing audio band measurement data. Even my older equipment can do like 300MB/s between DAQ hardware the DSPs, but that isn't very much when your talking about large image data.

Same problem happens when you start to process audio in the joint time-frequency domains. When I first started working on it in 2006 I quickly had to upgrade my computer 8GB, and even then I was running out of RAM and having to, god forbid, use disk swapping.
 
Re: Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

I do have a Pentax Eos Rebel (35mm?). Do they even make film anymore?
 
Re: Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

Rob Gow said:
I do have a Pentax Eos Rebel (35mm?). Do they even make film anymore?
Click to expand...

Eos and Rebel are both Canon product lines, so I'm guessing that Pentax was a thinko.

Film is very much still available, although sizes smaller than 35mm are hard to come by, and there are fewer choices of emulsion than there used to be. Prices have also gone up a bit in the past couple years.
 
Re: Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

Must be canon then. I know it's an Eos Rebel for sure. Not worth the trip to the garage to try and find it.
 
Re: Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

Bennett Prescott said:
It's because only dorks take pictures with an iPad. It's a camera of last resort, improving it won't matter to customers.
Click to expand...

Haha, dorks, that's the word. Your post made me chuckle.

My "favourite" is the guy photographing with the Ipad, with the giant flap of the protective sleeve hanging down below the Ipad :D
 
Re: Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

Oh great, it's not enough that that exists out there, you had to wake it up here.

TJ Cornish said:
Every time I start to get frustrated about silly threads on a pro audio forum, I need only go visit any photography forum for perspective. I'm not sure if it's the fact that live production actually takes work that keeps most of the neurotics at bay, but whatever it is, I'm grateful. Also, not reading the X32 thread helps. :)
Click to expand...

Hi Res forums can be quite frustrating. There is a very high chaff to wheat ratio.
For instance, there is a genius out there who is making his own DACs. To my mind, it is quite impressive stuff.
BUT, there is one reader who has grabbed onto two words in the conversation that he understands. Capacitor, and filter.
He is now convinced that DSD is an analog process. He is now convinced that DSD is so much more natural sounding than PCM because it is actually analog instead of digital. And no one will slap the shit out of him and tell him how stupid he is.
They just humor him, and let kind of hint at him not being right.
Makes me pine for Dave Stevens.
 
Re: Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

Actually, our HS photography/computer graphics teacher went on a little bit of a digression about his preferences for shooting stills of live shows, and he is all over Nikon because of, as he put it, "Canon makes great video cameras, but at any useful ISO they either have way too much noise or just don't catch all the shadowed details."

That and he really prefers the optics of Nikon to Canon. Funny, considering some of the comments earlier in this thread. :roll:
 
Re: Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

Max Warasila said:
Actually, our HS photography/computer graphics teacher went on a little bit of a digression about his preferences for shooting stills of live shows, and he is all over Nikon because of, as he put it, "Canon makes great video cameras, but at any useful ISO they either have way too much noise or just don't catch all the shadowed details."

That and he really prefers the optics of Nikon to Canon. Funny, considering some of the comments earlier in this thread. :roll:
Click to expand...

Both companies make some really good glass (and some junk.) I shot all Nikon on film, but when I was buying digital, Canon was a bit ahead in the tech at the time, so I bought into their stuff. It goes back and forth as new models come out. All the top camera bodies are pretty close right now in their test bench scores. It really comes down to nuanced decisions based on a feature a particular model might do better (and how invested in lenses you are), which will determine your choice of body.
 
Last edited:
Re: Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

Max Warasila said:
Actually, our HS photography/computer graphics teacher went on a little bit of a digression about his preferences for shooting stills of live shows, and he is all over Nikon because of, as he put it, "Canon makes great video cameras, but at any useful ISO they either have way too much noise or just don't catch all the shadowed details."

That and he really prefers the optics of Nikon to Canon. Funny, considering some of the comments earlier in this thread. :roll:
Click to expand...
Many features go back and forth between the big two. At the moment, Nikon has better low-ISO DR and the highest number of megapixels of any shipping camera (for about another 4 weeks until the 50MP 5DS). Canon has the fastest frame rate, anti-flicker tech (REALLY cool for shooting sports in artificial light), great professional services, and great ergonomics. Nikon flash metering is better than Canon in some circumstances; Canon's latest top of the line flash has a built-in radio trigger. Lots of things go back and forth, and the list changes with every camera release. Nikon bought a great sensor from Sony; Canon has done a lot of really cool software stuff. High-ISO performance is pretty much a wash.

The one area that there is general agreement is that Canon glass is in many instances better than Nikon glass. Since about 2010, Canon has been systematically replacing their lenses, and their recent professional grade zoom lenses are absolutely stunning. Their innovations in tilt-shift lenses and the new ultra-wide angle 11-24mm lens are unmatched by Nikon, whose lens catalog is largely older than Canon's.

For SLR video, Panasonic and Sony are ahead of both Canon and Nikon.

The good news for all of us is that we are free to pick whatever tools we feel are best for what we are trying to do, and the fact that there are multiple viable systems out there is good for consumers, as it keeps everybody innovating.
 
Re: Pro audio forums are nothing compared to...

And then there's the scary part... At what point will it start making a difference to the great police public (evening all)?
 
Top Bottom