x32 studio Users

[Per Søvik]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

Thanks guys, but all those options have been explored - switching back and forth to both Fiwi/usb, new cords, and then, I even went and got a new console from the dealer.
Now it appears to be worse.

When you look at the waveform on the recordings, or play back on the PC thru' headphones, are there clicks and scratches on the recorded material?
I tend to get lot of distortion, clicks, scratches and what have you when the DAW has been open for a while, but only on playback though, so saving the project, shutting the program down and then opening again means it is all clean and nice again. This happens in Cubase, Reaper, Power Tracks and Audacity with all my computers and all my interfaces, so I assume it is common.

 

[Jamie Alcorn]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

When you look at the waveform on the recordings, or play back on the PC thru' headphones, are there clicks and scratches on the recorded material?
I tend to get lot of distortion, clicks, scratches and what have you when the DAW has been open for a while, but only on playback though, so saving the project, shutting the program down and then opening again means it is all clean and nice again. This happens in Cubase, Reaper, Power Tracks and Audacity with all my computers and all my interfaces, so I assume it is common.

It starts on first play after the system has just been turned on. No noise on the actual audio, just on playback. And cracks and pops even if I play a track from itunes. Decided to hook up a Personus Fire studio sound card just for playback and... nice clean audio. The I/O seems to working perfectly fine. So I am guessing it might be a clocking issue with the Behringer ASIO drivers. Any thoughts?

 

[Per Søvik]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

Jamie, have you tried to reduce playback send levels by 10 dB as I suggested?

 

[Brian Monroe]

Re: Anyone using WDM drivers?

I think everything that related to sound editing works better, with lower latency and multi coreaudio outputs on a mac. But it just stops here the advantage of apple vs windows. I really like windows but I had many issues with asio drivers and multi playback with this driver and I quit doing sound editing and recording on windows platform. Everything else (I work as advertising art director) I do with a windows machine and I'm very happy with it, a lot better/improved user interface.

Have you thought of using Linux? I've been toying with the idea of creating a spin for the X32 so all the tough stuff is set up so it's more plug-n-play after you install it. Would you be interested in something like that?

 

[Nick Davis]

Re: Anyone using WDM drivers?

Forgot to mention levels, had to set up Reaper on a new computer today and didn't have my templates. Awful until I remembered to turn the outs down by 10 dB, can't remember how it was done in Cubase.

strange - I have no problems with reaper (that I am aware of). When you say turn down the outs do you mean on the x32 for the recording or on reaper for play back.
Re crackles did get it v occassionally on playback but restarting reaper solved it. Changed buffer size and went away.
I use usb and have recorded 5 hour festival sessions with no probs & only the occassional save - using w8

 

[Per Søvik]

Re: Anyone using WDM drivers?

strange - I have no problems with reaper (that I am aware of). When you say turn down the outs do you mean on the x32 for the recording or on reaper for play back.
Re crackles did get it v occassionally on playback but restarting reaper solved it. Changed buffer size and went away.
I use usb and have recorded 5 hour festival sessions with no probs & only the occassional save - using w8

Outputs from Reaper, someone suggested a long time ago to turn down levels, and it seemed to do the trick so I haven't spent any time investigating further.
USB into XP and W7, both seemed to behave the same. I have no logical explanation why turning the output down works, because there seems to be enough headroom everywhere in the chain. I might be running my buffers too small, and haven't got a dedicated computer for recording (both my FW machines are dead and needs to be resurrected for this purpose)
Anyone that feel up to compiling comprehensive guides for setting up recording with the various DAWs and submitting to the Behringer Wiki, please chime in. (small problem still with the Wiki installation, but I'm sure it will be solved)

 

[Jamie Alcorn]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

Jamie, have you tried to reduce playback send levels by 10 dB as I suggested?

Yep, tried that - and here's our latest update in the frustrating playback popping saga.
As a reminder - this is our set up: MacPro (2006) Quad core 3.0 with Snow Leopard, 10.6.8., connecting via usb 2.0 with the Behringer X32, Klein and Hummel near fields.
We have spent hours, days, weeks on this - and its getting a bit much. We have been the phone with Behringer techs, tried three different X32 consoles, 5 different Macs, a/b'd with a Presonus fire studio sound card and a Mackie Onyx via firewire, Snow Leopard, Mountain Lion, Cubase 7 and 6.5 and we have just played from itunes and cds. We checked the wiring in the studio, it is grounded properly, tried with no bluetooth, no wifi etc. We have tried every buffer size - presently at 192. Tried recording and playing back at 44.1 and 48 khz.

So this is what happens... The only time we DON'T get random popping and snapping in the audio playback (not the actual files) is when we used a 2011 Macbook Pro and played itunes through the console. We don't get noise with our Macpro with the other sound cards (older than the X32), but when using the X32 it always starts off with a few pops, then through time, gets worse and worse. Snapping a lot when stopping and starting the project. Using cubase, or just playing itunes.

It is starting to look like the X32 doesn't like the older Mac Pro. Anyone, anywhere have any thoughts on this? Someone suggested we get a usb 3.0 expansion card for the Macpro - but the reviews for these things look bad.
Feeling pretty beaten.

 

[Per Søvik]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

Jamie, we have assumed you use a PC, if you are on a Mac there are a few things, most of them I don't know anything about, but afaik you don't use windows or asio drivers with Mac.
Also, haven't this Mac got Firewire? Then use that. I'll leave it to Christian to paint the details, Mac is unknown territory to me.

 

[Brian Monroe]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

You know, I remember that some of the USB ports on the older Mac Pros are USB1 not even USB two in the front. You're plugged into USB in the back? You still have issues with FireWire right?

The only thing I can really think of is maybe driver bugs with the Server processors? Tried looking at top while playback is running?

 

[Jan Duwe]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

...
As a reminder - this is our set up: MacPro (2006) Quad core 3.0 with Snow Leopard, 10.6.8., connecting via usb 2.0 with the Behringer X32, Klein and Hummel near fields.
So this is what happens... The only time we DON'T get random popping and snapping in the audio playback (not the actual files) is when we used a 2011 Macbook Pro and played itunes through the console. We don't get noise with our Macpro with the other sound cards (older than the X32), but when using the X32 it always starts off with a few pops, then through time, gets worse and worse. ...

Dear Jamie,

Sorry to hear that you've been left without a solution for a while now. Let me assure that it is not the fault of our customer supporters. In fact our chip vendor, Archwave, had investigated over the past couple of months in this matter already, and finally got confirmed by Apple that there is a known sync issue with more than 18 channel i/o over USB 2.0.
While Apple has put this issue in a queue for bugfixing with no garantee that it may be addressed any time soon, Archwave has meanwhile found a workaround. We have just received a new firmware for the X-UF interface boards, operating the communication between X-UF and CoreAudio in 'explicit feedback mode'. According to the tests we performed recently, this completely cures the problem. We are about to release the Updater on our website probably begin of next week.
Note, that the X-UF updater tool will run on Windows PC either over FireWire or USB, provided that the X-UF drivers are properly installed on that PC. Please stay tuned to behringer.com for news in this matter.

Best,
Jan

 

[Jamie Alcorn]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

Dear Jamie,

Sorry to hear that you've been left without a solution for a while now. Let me assure that it is not the fault of our customer supporters. In fact our chip vendor, Archwave, had investigated over the past couple of months in this matter already, and finally got confirmed by Apple that there is a known sync issue with more than 18 channel i/o over USB 2.0.
While Apple has put this issue in a queue for bugfixing with no garantee that it may be addressed any time soon, Archwave has meanwhile found a workaround. We have just received a new firmware for the X-UF interface boards, operating the communication between X-UF and CoreAudio in 'explicit feedback mode'. According to the tests we performed recently, this completely cures the problem. We are about to release the Updater on our website probably begin of next week.
Note, that the X-UF updater tool will run on Windows PC either over FireWire or USB, provided that the X-UF drivers are properly installed on that PC. Please stay tuned to behringer.com for news in this matter.

Best,
Jan

Thanks Jan, yes, it has been a few weeks without being able to playback audio. Very frustrating. It might have been good if the Customer support staff mentioned they had a recognized problem and were working on it. We were told that they hadn't had these kinds of complaints and that they had two macs in the office (2012 and 2007) with the X32 - and they both played back just fine.
In any case, it sounds like you are on the right track with the updater and we look forward to trying it next week. But you should know that we did try it at 16 i/o and it continued. AND it was happening while playing back itunes and cd's. Will this updater address the sync issue entirely, for playback through the console in general?
Thanks,
Jamie

 

[Per Søvik]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

In fact our chip vendor, Archwave, had investigated over the past couple of months in this matter already, and finally got confirmed by Apple that there is a known sync issue with more than 18 channel i/o over USB 2.0.

So the FiWi works fine? This only affects the USB communication? That would confirm what we (sort of) have suspected since we first unpacked the consoles nearly a year ago.

Now, the CoreAudio part of this is what I don't really get. Is the windows driver not affected by this issue or is the windows driver bridging between CoreAudio protocol and asio and therefore equally affected? Sorry for my ignorance.

 

[Jamie Alcorn]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

FYI, Our firewire snaps even worse. So we are also confused about the Updater only applying to the USB communication.

And the customer service guys did say they were not getting anywhere near the calls from Windows users.

 

[Jamie Alcorn]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

So the FiWi works fine? This only affects the USB communication? That would confirm what we (sort of) have suspected since we first unpacked the consoles nearly a year ago.

So praise the audio gods...we have clean playback!! On firewire! With the MacPro 10.6.8, from core audio and from Cubase 7! So - if anyone still cares - this is what happened. We tried the firewire last week, when you suggested, and popping and snapping on playback was worse, so we replaced the console for the second time. Then we tried the new console with USB - popping and snapping. Went on to firewire and we only got some crazy digital noise, so we moved on to all the other trouble shooting. As it turns out, with this last good console, we just needed to reboot, reconnect and whamo - clean playback on fiwi. USB is still popping and cracking, so hopefully the new updater will address those issues for USB users.
Thank you all for all your help. We are up and running!

 

[Jamie Alcorn]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

Dear Jamie,

Sorry to hear that you've been left without a solution for a while now. Let me assure that it is not the fault of our customer supporters. In fact our chip vendor, Archwave, had investigated over the past couple of months in this matter already, and finally got confirmed by Apple that there is a known sync issue with more than 18 channel i/o over USB 2.0.
While Apple has put this issue in a queue for bugfixing with no garantee that it may be addressed any time soon, Archwave has meanwhile found a workaround. We have just received a new firmware for the X-UF interface boards, operating the communication between X-UF and CoreAudio in 'explicit feedback mode'. According to the tests we performed recently, this completely cures the problem. We are about to release the Updater on our website probably begin of next week.

Best,
Jan

Hey Jan - don't know if you saw the thread, but after reading your note about the USB troubles, on our third console we retried the firewire and we have success. No popping and snapping. We did, however, have some bad digital noise with the firewire, on playback, but only when we had another firewire external hard drive connected to the MacPro. Just wondering if that is something that has come up before? As soon as we unplugged the drive, audio was clean. And the same hard drive didn't affect audio in our laptop. So it seems like another firewire device on top of the X32, into the Mac Pro, is a problem as well?
Thanks,
Jamie

 

[Jan Duwe]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

...firewire, on playback, but only when we had another firewire external hard drive connected to the MacPro. Just wondering if that is something that has come up before? ... it seems like another firewire device on top of the X32, into the Mac Pro, is a problem as well?

Hi Jamie,

I am not aware of any issue with X-UF and Firewire. Just to see clearer--did you insert the HDD between the X-UF card and your Mac Pro? This is generally not a recommended setup, as you would have to pass the sync between Mac and console through the HDD bus controller.

Can you play back from the internal drive or an attached USB drive instead?

However, the X-UF fw update will soon be available, too.

Cheers,
Jan

 

[Ben Gingerich]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

I'm trying to post produce a live recording from reaper using the x32 as a full fledged controller, I have audio going into and out of reaper and the x32 but the faders do not sync with reaper, for instance moving channel 1 on the x32 does not move channel 1 (or anything else) on reaper, i thought i could post produce right from reaper and auto import all the channel names etc to the X32 from reaper, i think i remember that it could only go to the dca faders, am i correct? how do i make it work?

Here is my scene file

 

[Per Søvik]

Re: Using X32 with Cubase 7

I'm trying to post produce a live recording from reaper just using the x32 as a full fledged controller, I have audio going into and out of reaper and the x32 but the faders do not sync with reaper, for instance moving channel 1 on the x32 does not move channel 1 (or anything else) on reaper, i guess i can post produce right from reaper but i thought i could from the X32, am i correct?

I get a little confused by your use of terms here. You are saying you use the X32 as a controller, then you wouldn't be passing sound through it.
If you intend to use it for processing and mixdown, then of course you will send all channels to it, you then need to record the master track that you are producing. You will not be using the desk as a controller then.

If you use the X32 as a controller, then you can either use the Mackie emulation to control 8 faders at a time in Reaper, or alternatively you can look into X32MidiOsc that will emulate 6 Mackie controls to give you a full set of faders.

 

[Ben Gingerich]

Re: x32 studio Users

Thanks Per
I'm probably confused too, I'm a live guy that has never had to pay much attention to recording protocols, I will do some more studying.

My goal was to use the x32 as a controller to edit in the daw but I cannot get the mackie emulator to sync any of the faders.

 

[Per Søvik]

Re: x32 studio Users

Thanks Per
I'm probably confused too, I'm a live guy that has never had to pay much attention to recording protocols, I will do some more studying.

My goal was to use the x32 as a controller to edit in the daw but I cannot get the mackie emulator to sync any of the faders.

Just off the top of my head: You need to set the faders in Reaper to playback and also to write enable on touch (or something along those lines). I can't remember if there is a start sync of the faders that can be selected (that all fader positions is sent when you hit or resume play from any point).
[Sorry, I'm recording-only with Reaper, avoiding learning anything else until I have decided if I continue with Cubase or switch completely to Reaper]