60 Degree DIY Mid Hi - AKA PM60

Sheldon, I would love to build a trap version that could be arrayed, but the complexity with all the angles would make it almost impossible to build as a DIY project.

You also have to remember the design concept was Max SPL and sound quality on a stick (which you noted). When you have multiple boxes in an array they are not stick mountable and your design would use different compromises.

A 60 trap version that could be arrayed in pairs would be great. It could be used as a single 60 degree or in pairs to cover 100 - 120 degrees and looks much better that the current configuration.
 
To add on to what Peter said about the trap version - it's not impossible. I looked into building them, and somewhere deep in my archives there's a 3D cad version of the box that has 15 degree angles on either side of the box for 30 degree splay between them. There are several considerations in building it, however:
  1. The difficulty in cutting the baffles is extremely high. It requires either extensive table saw jig work or a large radial arm saw to do by hand, and custom ground (or changable) chamfer bits to CNC route. While this is clearly possible, as these kinds of baffles are used extensively in designs by companies such as d&b, Meyer, L'acoustics, JBL, and others, on a small scale it is pretty much unjustifiable to have the entire cabinet be a complete pain in the butt to build.
  2. The front of the cabinet becomes significantly larger to preserve a minimum internal width of 12" at the rear of the cabinet for where the 12" drivers fire into the horn.
    (If I recall correctly, it would have been nearly 600mm at the front, as compared to the current... 450? I don't remember.)
  3. The horn geometry for the bent horn would likely have to be changed, resulting in extensive prototyping issues.
  4. Ain't nobody got time for that.
If these were being made en-masse as a commercial product, this would be more of a possibility. For a DIY project, though, this is just too hard.
 
I've had a read through the thread, but can't seem to find it. Sooo.....

What EQ settings are people using for the BMS 4594HE / XT1464?

Using a Powersoft X8 if that helps, so maybe FIR filters might be a shout as well....

Thanks!
 
812031656d40f3e30ef55082a6bd54d5.jpg


Here is my PM60 doing outfill duty. They worked very very well.


 
  • Like
Reactions: Lukas Buzik
Huw Williams said:
I've had a read through the thread, but can't seem to find it. Sooo.....

What EQ settings are people using for the BMS 4594HE / XT1464?

Using a Powersoft X8 if that helps, so maybe FIR filters might be a shout as well....

Thanks!
Click to expand...

Huw, I had not responded because my EQ's are FIR files, and are no doubt too large to fit into the X8's available tap count.
But I got to thinking...if you are using either rephase or FirDesigner, I could send the project file and you could resize accordingly.

Let me know if that would help....
Oh, if so, are you bi-amping or using the BMS passive xover?
 
Don J Davis said:
David Sturzenbecher said:
812031656d40f3e30ef55082a6bd54d5.jpg


Here is my PM60 doing outfill duty. They worked very very well.
Click to expand...
Very nice set up David, how did they perform in this role for you?
Click to expand...

Hi Don,

The setup this particular night was for the comedian Gabriel Iglesias. For some unknown reason he has a huge draw in this area. Last year the count was over 12,000 (the marketing folks say 17,000 but that's a stretch) with over 2,000 turned away. This year, for the whole week of shows prior, we had been using JBL STX835 for some side fills. While those are good boxes, the PM60s had far more clarity over distance, which is why I wanted to give them a shot on the last night. There were powered 3 way with itech 4x3500s on each, with the linear phase FIR crossovers. The clarity at 200ft was unreal, especially when compared to the vertec.

7c01a6f24119ed4c900c448f8e55d012.jpg

Here is a photo from earlier in the week with the STX on outfill duty. This was the largest crowd besides fluffy, but you can get a good view of the space. For the comedian the stage line was stripped down to just the trailer and the decks the PM60s were on. As for the crowd, any and all flat ground (this side of the barricade) was densely filled with people.


 
  • Like
Reactions: Don J Davis
Mark Wilkinson said:
Huw, I had not responded because my EQ's are FIR files, and are no doubt too large to fit into the X8's available tap count.
But I got to thinking...if you are using either rephase or FirDesigner, I could send the project file and you could resize accordingly.

Let me know if that would help....
Oh, if so, are you bi-amping or using the BMS passive xover?
Click to expand...

Hi Mark

bi-amping the BMS drivers :)
 
hello,

I'm looking forward to build my first PM90. Was just wondering, I saw a tip if you wanna use CNC to build a box, is it better to use DXF file rather than PDF file. Any thoughts on this?
 
ivan cuic said:
hello,

I'm looking forward to build my first PM90. Was just wondering, I saw a tip if you wanna use CNC to build a box, is it better to use DXF file rather than PDF file. Any thoughts on this?
Click to expand...

Hi. The reason for this is that the .dxf files are accurate and do not require anywhere near as much work to use to program CAM software. The PDF drawings would require an export, or manual measurement that may alter the final product and cause misfit pieces. Also it's just more time and effort you don't need to be spending. The .dxf files were posted along with the drawings.
 
Max Warasila said:
Hi. The reason for this is that the .dxf files are accurate and do not require anywhere near as much work to use to program CAM software. The PDF drawings would require an export, or manual measurement that may alter the final product and cause misfit pieces. Also it's just more time and effort you don't need to be spending. The .dxf files were posted along with the drawings.
Click to expand...

thanks Max, makes sense!

I've just spent my afternoon reading the whole thread again and I found final version of a plan, but I didn't found .dxf file. Would you mind sharing it with me? Cheers Ivan
 
ivan cuic said:
thanks Max, makes sense!

I've just spent my afternoon reading the whole thread again and I found final version of a plan, but I didn't found .dxf file. Would you mind sharing it with me? Cheers Ivan
Click to expand...

So technically I lied - I posted a .dwg file, which is a less standard sort of interchange file than a .dxf. It's fundamentally the same, though. Let me know if you really need me to export a .dxf instead of the .dwg.

Max Warasila said:
And, many months later...

These are the dropbox links for the current .dwg and .pdf files. I will always keep these public facing ones as updated as possible if I make changes in the future, so check revision numbers and publication dates if you're wondering about a newer version.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/h16is6mbjig6fcy/pm90_current.pdf?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xiuyecjy9k6weph/pm90_current.dwg?dl=0

This has been quite a journey, from not knowing a darn thing about building cabinets to having these plans in a somewhat presentable format. Next project: something simpler!
Click to expand...
 
Hi David,

Love your pictures of the PM60 next to the 4888's ... fantastic.

FWIW you can get resonably good results if you have about 5 bands of PEQ per band on an IIR crossover, but you will not quite get the magic you can get with FIR filtering.

Peter
 
Max Warasila said:
So technically I lied - I posted a .dwg file, which is a less standard sort of interchange file than a .dxf. It's fundamentally the same, though. Let me know if you really need me to export a .dxf instead of the .dwg.
Click to expand...

Hy Max,

I downloaded again and what I get is "pm90_current.bak" file which i can't really open. If you would have time to send me .dxf file it would save me a lot of time! My address is [email protected]
Cheers Ivan
 
Top Bottom