Favorite Stage Monitor

Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

Michael Smithers said:
Has anyone here toured with the Clair CM22?
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Never toured with, but know one of the designers and have followed it's development. It's definitely the new benchmark wedge. Tuned by some of the best monitor engineers, gobs of LF output for modern acts needing kick and tracks, and some of the most robust and powerful components you will find. A real winner.
 
Favorite Stage Monitor

Graham C Mellor said:
Come down to my club in Providence. We've got 8 of the 12's in service and 4- FA15. They've been in used almost nightly for 3 years and will tear your face off at 10 feet. Dainty my ass, lol.
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Haha for sure, I believe they will tear your face off at 10 feet. That's my experience as well. How have the bottom edges faired? Have you added anything to them? Do they slide around?
 
Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

Graham C Mellor said:
Come down to my club in Providence. We've got 8 of the 12's in service and 4- FA15. They've been in used almost nightly for 3 years and will tear your face off at 10 feet. Dainty my ass, lol.
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Phenomenal boxes, an FA15 tore my face off once at Fête. Any artist I've worked with there was impressed with both the 15" and 12" wedges as well.
 
Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

Do the D&B or Clair wedges use FIR filters? If so, or maybe even if not, has anyone measure the latency? I'm curious if anyone has had issues with noticeable delay.
 
Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

Jason Raboin said:
Do the D&B or Clair wedges use FIR filters? If so, or maybe even if not, has anyone measure the latency? I'm curious if anyone has had issues with noticeable delay.
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The d&b d12 and d6 latency is 0.3ms end to end for all their speakers according to the documentation. This doesn't take into account driver alignment delay for biamp cabinets.
 
Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

Michael Smithers said:
Has anyone here toured with the Clair CM22?
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Toured with, and beat the shit out of them. Probably the loudest wedge on earth. It can go from "nice & gentle" sounding, to rip your face off in a matter of seconds. We've put kick drum and bass guitar into them and pounded on them. Bassist was in love. Makes the d&b M2 seem like a toy. :)



Oh, but my favorite stage monitor is, well, no stage monitor. I like in-ears. 8)~8-)~:cool:





Evan
 
Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

Evan Kirkendall said:
Toured with, and beat the shit out of them. Probably the loudest wedge on earth. It can go from "nice & gentle" sounding, to rip your face off in a matter of seconds. We've put kick drum and bass guitar into them and pounded on them. Bassist was in love. Makes the d&b M2 seem like a toy. :)



Oh, but my favorite stage monitor is, well, no stage monitor. I like in-ears. 8)~8-)~:cool:





Evan
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What's in them 2 x 12 + 2" ?? Clair's spec sheet doesn't say much at all.
 
Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

I am always suspicious of wedges with LF vents that exit to the stage deck. Is it desirable to have this time-uncorrelated bass energy pounding what is typically a compliant surface?

If there is a vocal microphone nearby the stand base gets pounded. Much of the energy is mitigated by use of strip HPF, but it is still rattling the stand and capsule.

Someone remarked on a Clair wedge "GBF", which isn't a loudspeaker measurement at all, but may indicate a spikiness in net monitor system response.
 
Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

Chris Johnson said:
Assuming I never have to touch or lift them, then I'd say the M2 is my all time favorite. Sounds great, tons of power and low-end extension.

But. They are massive and very heavy, so once you take that into consideration, the M4 wins every time. Its significantly smaller and lighter, and still has 80-90% of the power and extension of the M2.

The M6 isn't half bad either!
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Yep. Badass wedge.

On the more affordable end, I recently did a show with EAW SM200's. It was the first time I've used them and was quite pleased with the size/output/performance and would be happy to use them again for any time when big boy wedges aren't an option.
 
Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

I suspect it's no worse than the axial vibration transmitted down through the cabinet from the cone movement (or any face ports) to the stage. Not to mention that with floor vents, much of the vibration is tangential to the floor. I'd be surprised if floor vents are a problem with wedges. The more likely problem is stage vibration from the subs. And if a microphone is sensitive to this, I'd be looking for faulty capsule suspension and replacing it.

Jim McKeveny said:
I am always suspicious of wedges with LF vents that exit to the stage deck. Is it desirable to have this time-uncorrelated bass energy pounding what is typically a compliant surface?

If there is a vocal microphone nearby the stand base gets pounded. Much of the energy is mitigated by use of strip HPF, but it is still rattling the stand and capsule.
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Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

Jim McKeveny said:
I am always suspicious of wedges with LF vents that exit to the stage deck. Is it desirable to have this time-uncorrelated bass energy pounding what is typically a compliant surface?

If there is a vocal microphone nearby the stand base gets pounded. Much of the energy is mitigated by use of strip HPF, but it is still rattling the stand and capsule.

Someone remarked on a Clair wedge "GBF", which isn't a loudspeaker measurement at all, but may indicate a spikiness in net monitor system response.
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Consider that the amount of bass energy "pounding" out of the wedges is directly a result of what the ME puts in them. The CM22 is designed to sound great for a vocals only mix high passed at 160hz, while being robust enough to pound out low end for <insert top 40 act here> running around the stage with a wireless, in which case the floor vibration is fairly irrelevant.
 
Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

I guess I am looking at this from a "bigger picture" perspective. We attempt to get subs to operate in a maximally productive, sonically integrated manner. Random wedges on a deck with prodigious LF/VLF outputs are, at minimum, unhelpful.

Buying/renting/transporting/storing/insuring/humping multiple wedge systems that boast prodigious LF, but must be filtered (save for the mixes for drummer or DJ) to be usable doesn't seem particularly efficient.
 
Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

Jim McKeveny said:
I guess I am looking at this from a "bigger picture" perspective. We attempt to get subs to operate in a maximally productive, sonically integrated manner. Random wedges on a deck with prodigious LF/VLF outputs are, at minimum, unhelpful.

Buying/renting/transporting/storing/insuring/humping multiple wedge systems that boast prodigious LF, but must be filtered (save for the mixes for drummer or DJ) to be usable doesn't seem particularly efficient.
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The other option is to have a few monitors with more LF output, and keep a bigger batch of "vox only" wedges whose design (mechanical or electrical) creates a significant HP filter.

But I think Tom M has a point- ultimately the BME is going to use the assets to make his/her artist happy no matter what it does to the house sound. End of story. I'd also submit that of the audience attending an event such as Tom describes, only 0.01% of them will give a shit about subwoofer/LF pattern.

Not a hip-hop gig, but relevant: Several years ago we had a gig with Delbert McClinton; his mixerperson set monitors with our ME. There was a whole bunch of 120-250Hz in every front line wedge, and with an overall level guaranteed to create problems in the FOH mix. I mentioned this to him and his reply was "Delbert signs my check, and if he doesn't like the way his voice sounds when he says 'hello' to the audience, he stops signing my check." The BE had to add so much HF to cut over the stage SPL (mostly wedges) that about 20% of the audience left in the first 3 songs. I have no idea what Delbert expects these days, maybe he's on IEMs now.

YMMV and all that... and in principle I agree with your observations, Jim, but the _artiste reality_ presents challenges that we have to accommodate regardless of impact on other things.
 
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Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

Thanks for your response Tim.

Every now and then I forget that our business is, in essence, a concierge/hospitality enterprise.

Eeeesh..
 
Re: Favorite Stage Monitor

Jim McKeveny said:
I guess I am looking at this from a "bigger picture" perspective. We attempt to get subs to operate in a maximally productive, sonically integrated manner. Random wedges on a deck with prodigious LF/VLF outputs are, at minimum, unhelpful.
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I agree with Michael Smithers. Most wedges are ported, they still are too small to produce "prodigious" LF/VLF output when compared to the subs used on most shows, but the reduction in excursion the port provides at the low end cleans up the vocal range when driven hard. The location of the vent port, whether on the front near the floor (where it can make a convenient handle without wasting precious internal space) or on the front baffle (where they tend to let out more rear cone midrange, smearing the vocal range) makes very little (if any) difference in the stage deck excitation.
 
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