X32 Discussion

[Dejan Vuckovic]

Monitor out noise

I'm having 5-6 kHz noise on the monitor out...what's the procedure for fixing this? Any disassembly instructions?

 

[Dan Mortensen]

Re: Monitor out noise

I'm having 5-6 kHz noise on the monitor out...what's the procedure for fixing this? Any disassembly instructions?

Hi Dejan,

See my post #4982 on 2-14-2013.

Short version: You cannot fix this. Maybe the Behringer Service Center can, and maybe it can't.

Also, you opening the console voids the warranty.

Good luck,
Dan

 

[Rick A. DeNardo]

Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Hi ,
One more quick question,to any knowledgable Behringer Rep. Would the S16 work as a standalone analog in/analog out
I/O box? In other words, taking eight analog inputs and sending them through an S16 as say, a monitor manager, without need of the Cat5 connection?

 

[Josh Tamez]

Re: Monitor out noise

Are you saying the Behringer Service Center sometimes cannot fix the problem??? And those owners are left to deal with that noise in their irremediable consoles ???

Hi Dejan,

See my post #4982 on 2-14-2013.

Short version: You cannot fix this. Maybe the Behringer Service Center can, and maybe it can't.

Also, you opening the console voids the warranty.

Good luck,
Dan

 

[Jim Knowles]

Re: Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A

Hi ,
One more quick question,to any knowledgable Behringer Rep. Would the S16 work as a standalone analog in/analog out
I/O box? In other words, taking eight analog inputs and sending them through an S16 as say, a monitor manager, without need of the Cat5 connection?

Hi Rick,

I will PM you regarding this matter right away.

Kind Regards
Jim Knowles
CARE EMEA / Tech Support
MUSIC Group / BEHRINGER

 

[Jim Knowles]

Re: Monitor out noise

Are you saying the Behringer Service Center sometimes cannot fix the problem??? And those owners are left to deal with that noise in their irremediable consoles ???

Hi Josh,

Sorry to hear you are having difficulty with your console. I will PM you right away to discuss this matter further.

Kind Regards
Jim Knowles
CARE EMEA / Tech Support
MUSIC Group / BEHRINGER

 

[Steve Maksim]

Re: Monitor out noise

Are you saying the Behringer Service Center sometimes cannot fix the problem??? And those owners are left to deal with that noise in their irremediable consoles ???

Josh, I'm pretty sure that Dan was just advising you that because of the warranty that you yourself should not attempt the remedy. Behringer has shown themselves to be quite responsive in fixing problems.

 

[Steve Maksim]

Re: Send on Faders button should Flash!

Flashing lights for alternate modes are a necessity.

On Avid VENUE, a mute button light has 3 possible indications: off - the channel mute is not engaged; on steady - the channel has been muted manually by direct activation of that channel's mute button and; on flashing - the channel mute has been activated by a mute group. And if a channel is part of a mute group but is manually muted, it will remain muted when the mute group is deactivated.

Tim, approximately how quickly do the lights blink on the VENUE?

I understand how a blinking interface can be useful. When using blinking interfaces, though, I've found some rates of blinking to be more annoying than others. I heard that Apple did some research into this, but I don't know any specifics.

 

[Tim McCulloch]

Re: Send on Faders button should Flash!

Tim, approximately how quickly do the lights blink on the VENUE?

I understand how a blinking interface can be useful. When using blinking interfaces, though, I've found some rates of blinking to be more annoying than others. I heard that Apple did some research into this, but I don't know any specifics.

Hm. I've never given it much thought, Steve. It's not "Danger! Danger, Will Robinson!" fast, nor is it slow. Probably a little slower that 2x/second, faster than 1x/second for sure.

 

[Eric Hill - USA]

Re: Send on Faders button should Flash!

When using blinking interfaces, though, I've found some rates of blinking to be more annoying than others. I heard that Apple did some research into this, but I don't know any specifics.

In addition to the blink rate, there's also the sequence (timing) with other lights that are blinking.

For example, if the "Sends on Faders" and "Solo" lights are both on/off at the same time, we have two blinking lights. During each cycle, if we have one on, and the other off, the light will appear to be jumping back and forth.

Then, we also have color and intensity to consider.

Eric H.

 

[Dan Mortensen]

Re: Monitor out noise

Are you saying the Behringer Service Center sometimes cannot fix the problem??? And those owners are left to deal with that noise in their irremediable consoles ???

Before you get too far up on your high horse about this, realize that this is an extraordinary console for the price and does many, many things remarkably well. The company, clearly driven by the applaudable zeal of its founder, as a whole seems to be incredibly responsive to every other X32 problem, as well as to regularly fixing nuanced issues that only continue to make a good console better.

Also understand that if the monitor outputs are super important to you, you can get that same output function out of any of the other 16 analog outputs, and they are all dead quiet (or what can pass for dead quiet in the real world).

That said, the last I heard from the Service Center about this issue, and you can read earlier in this thread everything that I've heard, they were still grappling with the idea that there is, in fact, a problem with the monitor outputs. As shown by the post I referenced, all nine of my consoles (which, to be fair, are all of the same vintage more or less despite receiving them over a four month period) have the problem.

Further, since I've been following this issue, I am not aware of anyone who has reported having this problem with their console subsequently reporting that the problem has been solved. I am not omnicient, though, and may have missed something.

For my company's purposes, rerouting the monitor outputs to any of the other 16 analog outputs fully and completely solves the problem, leaving us with nine wonderfully affordable and functional consoles.

I hope this perspective is helpful.

 

[Liam Donaldson]

Keep original box for possible warranty return?

Should we keep the original box for possible warranty fixes or does Behringer send another box?

I'd like to make some room by storing the original box somewhere or breaking it down so it would be nice to know if they send another for returns.

Anyone know about this?

 

[Jim Knowles]

Re: Keep original box for possible warranty return?

Should we keep the original box for possible warranty fixes or does Behringer send another box?

I'd like to make some room by storing the original box somewhere or breaking it down so it would be nice to know if they send another for returns.

Anyone know about this?

Hi Liam

It would be a good idea to keep the box just incase you should ever need to return the console for warranty repair unless you plan to purchase a flightcase in which case you can send the console into us in the flightcase. Should you have any further questions or require any further assistance then please feel free to contact me.

Kind Regards
Jim Knowles
CARE EMEA / Tech Support
MUSIC Group / BEHRINGER

 

[Eric Hill - USA]

Re: Send on Faders button should Flash!

Sorry, I didn't see the other request. It seems that the idea is quite popular. Eric, why do you think it might not be possible? This is the sort of thing that is very easy to implement in firmware, I believe, but I'm no expert.

Maybe I should have used the word "practical" instead of "possible."

I used to do a lot of software development. Sometimes items that appear very simple on the surface are complex (i.e., time consuming and costly) to implement.

Eric H.

 

[Per Søvik]

Re: Expansion Slot Idea

My statement was conjecture. You have experience? Please enlighten me!

No experience, pure conjecture based on my semi-informed impression about the capability of cirquitry available over the last 30 years.
My impression of the Sony Oxford was that it was built as one massively powerful DSP core along construction principles found in supercomputers like the Cray at the time, while the (related) DMX-R100 was built with a multiple of RISC or SHARC processors that worked on specialized tasks and separated datastreams. The Oxford could route anything anywhere, and it was all done in software, while the R100 had some limitations because the flow of datastreams were to some extent hardwired. These two desks represented not only two extremes of the pricing scale, but also two different directions of hardware and how that influenced flexibility.
I don't really know anything about the internals of the X32, and how many DSPs share the work, but am assuming there is a central DSP that communicates with an IO section and that there might be a software controlled multiplexer or matrix between the two. Routing, whether that is rearranging chunks in a serial stream or connecting a n-wide bus through a matrix is in all probability done by setting bits in a n by n table.
I can understand that at some point, the streams from the ADs are likely to be routed by the stream size, ie. if the AD is a 192KHz device that will do 4 channels at 48 KHZ, than the routing will be done by 4 up to a point where the stream will be split or multiplexed further, (or by 8 if it is a 384KHz device), and that if indeed the X32 is based on processing of several 384KHz datastreams, a lot of the routing will be defined by the streams, and thus the limitation will be due to hardware architecture.
Anyway, I'm just rambling, pay no attention ~~:smile:

 

[Chris Wadden]

Re: Expansion Slot Idea

No experience, pure conjecture based on my semi-informed impression about the capability of cirquitry available over the last 30 years.
My impression of the Sony Oxford was that it was built as one massively powerful DSP core along construction principles found in supercomputers like the Cray at the time, while the (related) DMX-R100 was built with a multiple of RISC or SHARC processors that worked on specialized tasks and separated datastreams. The Oxford could route anything anywhere, and it was all done in software, while the R100 had some limitations because the flow of datastreams were to some extent hardwired. These two desks represented not only two extremes of the pricing scale, but also two different directions of hardware and how that influenced flexibility.
I don't really know anything about the internals of the X32, and how many DSPs share the work, but am assuming there is a central DSP that communicates with an IO section and that there might be a software controlled multiplexer or matrix between the two. Routing, whether that is rearranging chunks in a serial stream or connecting a n-wide bus through a matrix is in all probability done by setting bits in a n by n table.
I can understand that at some point, the streams from the ADs are likely to be routed by the stream size, ie. if the AD is a 192KHz device that will do 4 channels at 48 KHZ, than the routing will be done by 4 up to a point where the stream will be split or multiplexed further, (or by 8 if it is a 384KHz device), and that if indeed the X32 is based on processing of several 384KHz datastreams, a lot of the routing will be defined by the streams, and thus the limitation will be due to hardware architecture.
Anyway, I'm just rambling, pay no attention ~~:smile:

I feel I can comprehend a small amount of what you said, but the rest made me pass out sitting up for fifteen minutes.

 

[Per Søvik]

Re: Expansion Slot Idea

I feel I can comprehend a small amount of what you said, but the rest made me pass out sitting up for fifteen minutes.

Probably because I'm just talking gibberish. ~;-)~:wink:
It would be good if someone from Behringer could tell us a bit about the construction of the X32, show us a block diagram and give us some insight to the design philosophy, but that is probably wishful thinking or it would have happened already.

 

[Steve Maksim]

Re: Expansion Slot Idea

Probably because I'm just talking gibberish. ~;-)~:wink:
It would be good if someone from Behringer could tell us a bit about the construction of the X32, show us a block diagram and give us some insight to the design philosophy, but that is probably wishful thinking or it would have happened already.

Or perhaps a bunch of us could pool our money to buy a console to do a tear down a la ifiixit.com. I'm curious how much is COTS and how much is custom silicon. At 20,000-50,000 units it's not necessarily clear which way would be cheaper to go. If the chips are COTS and the tops haven't been sanded off or potted then it would be fairly trivial to get a rough outline of what's going on. I wouldn't be surprised at all to find something like Xilinx FPGA's inside control a lot of the i/o and dedicated DSP's doing the heavy lifting.

I'd throw in $20. Would another 150 people do the same?

 

[Josh Tamez]

Re: Monitor out noise

Acknowledgement for the extraordinary console for the price the X32 is, and that it does many, many things remarkably well (as you point out) has nothing to do with the fact that my console has gone up to the service center and returned still with the noise in the headphones for which it went in. If you can spare an output to feed a headphone amp and then your headphones, congratulations for your ingenuity, you are truly a gifted one. I don't plan on carrying an extra headphone amp to make up for something as basic as headphone monitoring that can be had in a $40 analog console made by Behringer too.

You wrote: "Short version: You cannot fix this. Maybe the Behringer Service Center can, and maybe it can't."

By writing "..and maybe it can't" you seemed to know that maybe this is not a fixable problem, given what you wrote, I politely asked my question as you seemed to maybe have info I didn't, but forget that...

Before you get too far up on your high horse about this, realize that this is an extraordinary console for the price and does many, many things remarkably well. The company, clearly driven by the applaudable zeal of its founder, as a whole seems to be incredibly responsive to every other X32 problem, as well as to regularly fixing nuanced issues that only continue to make a good console better.

Also understand that if the monitor outputs are super important to you, you can get that same output function out of any of the other 16 analog outputs, and they are all dead quiet (or what can pass for dead quiet in the real world).

That said, the last I heard from the Service Center about this issue, and you can read earlier in this thread everything that I've heard, they were still grappling with the idea that there is, in fact, a problem with the monitor outputs. As shown by the post I referenced, all nine of my consoles (which, to be fair, are all of the same vintage more or less despite receiving them over a four month period) have the problem.

Further, since I've been following this issue, I am not aware of anyone who has reported having this problem with their console subsequently reporting that the problem has been solved. I am not omnicient, though, and may have missed something.

For my company's purposes, rerouting the monitor outputs to any of the other 16 analog outputs fully and completely solves the problem, leaving us with nine wonderfully affordable and functional consoles.

I hope this perspective is helpful.

 

[Chris Ludaescher]

How to set up external effects?

If customs does not fail me, I'll get my X32 and a S16 tomorrow...probably the first one in Vietnam. I still have two BOSS SX700 Studio effects which I dearly love and now (after all the wait and trouble to get the X32 appears to be over) I start to wonder, how is actually the best way to integrate them into the workflow of the X32. At least now I am not going to get close to use all 32 inputs, and outputs should be free as well. Any advise?

Greetings form Hanoi!