X32 Discussion
- Thread starter Rob Spence
- Start date
Re: X32 v2 RTA
Had a nasty crackling sound/pops/loss of audio last night. Happened a few times, in 3 to 10 min intervals in between. I dig into forums, something like that was discussed about a year and a half ago, but nothing really suggested, just a bunch of different opinions why it may happen. Most suggest going with shielded CAT5 and Etherconns.
Symptoms: Screen is shaking without going fully blank or dark prior to either complete loss of audio for 1-2 sec, or loud pop first, similar to snare drum sound, then loss of audio. Sometimes even on breaks with no sound in the system (except for background noise from mics).
Conditions: One S16, 300 feet unshielded CAT5e with regular connectors (not Etherconns)
Wooden rack with only S16 and Driverack PA+ sitting on top of it, both plugged into the same power strip via standard 3-prong power cords.
Commercial building (church), I checked both power outlets (feeding mixer and stagebox respectively), grounding is OK.
My first guess was a loss of sync in that near-limit long CAT5 cable, but no way to check for that. Could also be a static charge build-up.
Any new ideas on that crackling noise/loss of audio problem? What are the solutions that worked?
Had a nasty crackling sound/pops/loss of audio last night. Happened a few times, in 3 to 10 min intervals in between. I dig into forums, something like that was discussed about a year and a half ago, but nothing really suggested, just a bunch of different opinions why it may happen. Most suggest going with shielded CAT5 and Etherconns.
Symptoms: Screen is shaking without going fully blank or dark prior to either complete loss of audio for 1-2 sec, or loud pop first, similar to snare drum sound, then loss of audio. Sometimes even on breaks with no sound in the system (except for background noise from mics).
Conditions: One S16, 300 feet unshielded CAT5e with regular connectors (not Etherconns)
Wooden rack with only S16 and Driverack PA+ sitting on top of it, both plugged into the same power strip via standard 3-prong power cords.
Commercial building (church), I checked both power outlets (feeding mixer and stagebox respectively), grounding is OK.
My first guess was a loss of sync in that near-limit long CAT5 cable, but no way to check for that. Could also be a static charge build-up.
Any new ideas on that crackling noise/loss of audio problem? What are the solutions that worked?
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Re: X32 v2 RTA
It was also very important that proper grounding of the x32 (and s16?) was crusial.
Test showed that shielded cat5 with ethercons did an enormous improvement for signal integrity in situations with much static buildup.
It was also very important that proper grounding of the x32 (and s16?) was crusial.
Re: X32 v2 RTA
You already gave yourself the answers...
Solution = shielded CAT5 , with ethercons
use < 300 feet Of cat5. (I went with 260')
It Could also be a static charge build-up.
You already gave yourself the answers...
Solution = shielded CAT5 , with ethercons
use < 300 feet Of cat5. (I went with 260')
It Could also be a static charge build-up.
Re: X32 v2 RTA
OK, I'll try pre-made shielded cable. Also, by "proper grounding" you mean no more than using a standard IEC 3-prong power cords and checking outlets for ground? Nothing crazy like running a separate ground wire from mixer chassis to a nearest water pipe?
OK, I'll try pre-made shielded cable. Also, by "proper grounding" you mean no more than using a standard IEC 3-prong power cords and checking outlets for ground? Nothing crazy like running a separate ground wire from mixer chassis to a nearest water pipe?
Re: X32 v2 RTA
Might want to make sure both grounds in your wall outlets are actually the same and properly installed before you use them. Check out TJ's blog post here: http://soundforums.net/blogs/tj-cornish/565-basic-receptacle-testing.html
Also, his addition, here: http://soundforums.net/blogs/tj-cornish/871-receptacle-testing-1-1.html
Might want to make sure both grounds in your wall outlets are actually the same and properly installed before you use them. Check out TJ's blog post here: http://soundforums.net/blogs/tj-cornish/565-basic-receptacle-testing.html
Also, his addition, here: http://soundforums.net/blogs/tj-cornish/871-receptacle-testing-1-1.html
Re: X32 Discussion
Well, I've been in sales long enough to use the "WOW" factor at its full. A nice lady promoter who gave me this gig (a two-day event that paid almost half or what I've paid for X32) had some idea about sound systems in general, but never saw remote control from a phone. The fact that I can check mics on stage myself, moving their channel faders from the phone while speaking in that mic left her speechless! Sure it will get me more gigs, even though it has nothing to do with sound quality and rest of X32 features.
Well, I've been in sales long enough to use the "WOW" factor at its full. A nice lady promoter who gave me this gig (a two-day event that paid almost half or what I've paid for X32) had some idea about sound systems in general, but never saw remote control from a phone. The fact that I can check mics on stage myself, moving their channel faders from the phone while speaking in that mic left her speechless! Sure it will get me more gigs, even though it has nothing to do with sound quality and rest of X32 features.
Re: X32 v2 RTA
I've also noticed that some ethernet cables insulation (pvc?) becomes static themself so with a 300' cable it can conduct a lot of charge.
Ground in some venues may not be worth the name so you should always make sure that you have a proper ground.
I've also noticed that some ethernet cables insulation (pvc?) becomes static themself so with a 300' cable it can conduct a lot of charge.
Re: Tablet for X32 Rack
A soldering iron, a couple of connectors and a small box from Radio Shack and you can make this in 10 minutes. Well, at least I was able to do it. I like the clip and the one that Eric found is a very nice find. I also have considered adding a 1/4" input as well to give it maximum flexibility. Maybe I should buy a silk screen machine and make these things and in 50 years I could break even. Thanks Eric for sharing this find and for keeping me from making a bad business decision like spending thousands of dollars on sound and lighting gear and thinking I will ever recoup my investment in a timely fashion. Still enjoy mixing after 30 years and will continue to spend on gear when needed.
A soldering iron, a couple of connectors and a small box from Radio Shack and you can make this in 10 minutes. Well, at least I was able to do it. I like the clip and the one that Eric found is a very nice find. I also have considered adding a 1/4" input as well to give it maximum flexibility. Maybe I should buy a silk screen machine and make these things and in 50 years I could break even. Thanks Eric for sharing this find and for keeping me from making a bad business decision like spending thousands of dollars on sound and lighting gear and thinking I will ever recoup my investment in a timely fashion. Still enjoy mixing after 30 years and will continue to spend on gear when needed.
Re: X32 v2 RTA
Get a rack mounted ups, put it in a rack with your s16. Run an a/c to foh from that... Stick with that you should be good
Get a rack mounted ups, put it in a rack with your s16. Run an a/c to foh from that... Stick with that you should be good
Re: X32 v2 RTA
Fair enough. I did say up front that it was likely an ungrateful-sounding and contentious post...
I love my X32 and am thrilled that Behringer continue to improve it for free. There are certainly many other things in v2 which are going to be very useful to me, such as the MIDI implementation (I got basic fader automation working yesterday with Reaper).
The Auto-Gain is switchable, and the behavior seems consistent. The scale just needs to move.
Fair enough. I did say up front that it was likely an ungrateful-sounding and contentious post...
I love my X32 and am thrilled that Behringer continue to improve it for free. There are certainly many other things in v2 which are going to be very useful to me, such as the MIDI implementation (I got basic fader automation working yesterday with Reaper).
The Auto-Gain is switchable, and the behavior seems consistent. The scale just needs to move.
Re: X32 v2 RTA
While on the subject of RTAs, has anyone tried using the I/O of the X32 for a real RTA like SMAART?
I'm guessing that, for dual-channel analysis, one should duplicate the main on a second physical output and route that back to a second mic input with a cable in order to cancel out the non-linearity in the analog I/O, and then take both those inputs to the XUF, rather than just the measurement mic input and an internal route of the output.
I think I'm going to break out my Dayton Audio EMM-1 and get a demo copy of SMAART Di, and try it...
...once I've finished reading Bruce McCarthy's "Sound System Design and Optimization" book, anyway.
While on the subject of RTAs, has anyone tried using the I/O of the X32 for a real RTA like SMAART?
I'm guessing that, for dual-channel analysis, one should duplicate the main on a second physical output and route that back to a second mic input with a cable in order to cancel out the non-linearity in the analog I/O, and then take both those inputs to the XUF, rather than just the measurement mic input and an internal route of the output.
I think I'm going to break out my Dayton Audio EMM-1 and get a demo copy of SMAART Di, and try it...
...once I've finished reading Bruce McCarthy's "Sound System Design and Optimization" book, anyway.
Re: X32 Discussion
Sure, we all are, to some extent. Selling our products, services, skills, or even picking up chicks in a club. Same shit.
Customers do have a choice, and usually more than a few.
Sure, we all are, to some extent. Selling our products, services, skills, or even picking up chicks in a club. Same shit.
Customers do have a choice, and usually more than a few.
Re: X32 v2 RTA
Good idea, certainly. But you are dealing with bunch of other ground paths too. Like shielded XLRs from S16 to amps/speakers. You may never know where that static comes from. As Robert noted, PVC insulation can get static charge too, try to drag a 300" snake over the carpet floor (could've been the cause of my problem yesterday).
Good idea, certainly. But you are dealing with bunch of other ground paths too. Like shielded XLRs from S16 to amps/speakers. You may never know where that static comes from. As Robert noted, PVC insulation can get static charge too, try to drag a 300" snake over the carpet floor (could've been the cause of my problem yesterday).
Libraries
X32-Edit 1.20 / Core Firmware 1.15 :
I'm probably late on this one, but will the highpass be included in the equalizer - and therefore be saved
in the equalizer's library ?
Highpass settings are saved in the channels/config library ( .chn ), now, as far as I see
BTW
Where are the libraries actually stored ( not saved ) I mean, when libraries are created, not saved, and X32-Edit is closed, the libraries are there when relaunching X32-Edit...
Thanks
Klaus
X32-Edit 1.20 / Core Firmware 1.15 :
I'm probably late on this one, but will the highpass be included in the equalizer - and therefore be saved
in the equalizer's library ?
Highpass settings are saved in the channels/config library ( .chn ), now, as far as I see
BTW
Where are the libraries actually stored ( not saved ) I mean, when libraries are created, not saved, and X32-Edit is closed, the libraries are there when relaunching X32-Edit...
Thanks
Klaus
Re: X32 v2 RTA
An RTA is not a dual channel FFT analyzer. Stop saying they are similar. They are not.
You are confused as to the various tools.
SMAART does include an RTA along with many other functions.
From what I have read here, it seems that what the V2 firmware includes is a Spectrograph (or waterfall display).
At no time have I seen anyone with knowledge state anything about the inclusion of a dual (or multi) channel FFT analyzer.
Sent from my iPad HD
An RTA is not a dual channel FFT analyzer. Stop saying they are similar. They are not.
You are confused as to the various tools.
SMAART does include an RTA along with many other functions.
From what I have read here, it seems that what the V2 firmware includes is a Spectrograph (or waterfall display).
At no time have I seen anyone with knowledge state anything about the inclusion of a dual (or multi) channel FFT analyzer.
Sent from my iPad HD
Re: X32 v2 RTA
Thank you. I guess that explains the source of my disappointment. I was under the impression that they were one and the same, as I have seen the terms used interchangeably elsewhere.
Like I said, I haven't finished reading that book yet...
Another possible bug, or maybe it's intentional... when you are viewing the RTA for a channel on its own EQ page, and you switch it to Spectrograph mode, then select a different channel, it reverts to Bar-Graph mode. Intuitively, I would have expected the mode to persist, or at least be remembered per-channel.
Thank you. I guess that explains the source of my disappointment. I was under the impression that they were one and the same, as I have seen the terms used interchangeably elsewhere.
Like I said, I haven't finished reading that book yet...
Another possible bug, or maybe it's intentional... when you are viewing the RTA for a channel on its own EQ page, and you switch it to Spectrograph mode, then select a different channel, it reverts to Bar-Graph mode. Intuitively, I would have expected the mode to persist, or at least be remembered per-channel.
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X32-Edit 1.20 Crash Bug
I have reported this on the Behringer forums also, but I'll mention it here too, in the hope that it might get fixed before the release of X32-Edit to match Firmware v2.0.
X32-Edit with BCF2000 control surface set to "MC C" mode, Mackie Remote mode enabled, select the last bank on the surface to access the DCA faders and mutes.
If you (perhaps accidentally) hit the STORE button on the surface, X32-Edit crashes out instantly!
On any other bank, it seems safe to push, although quite what it does I have no bloody idea - the knobs at the top change their displayed value, but when you hit EXIT they don't go back to what they were. That, I can live with. A crash, not so much.
This is on Mac, with v1.20, not connected to a console (can't test whether that makes a difference right now, as my router is elsewhere).
I have reported this on the Behringer forums also, but I'll mention it here too, in the hope that it might get fixed before the release of X32-Edit to match Firmware v2.0.
X32-Edit with BCF2000 control surface set to "MC C" mode, Mackie Remote mode enabled, select the last bank on the surface to access the DCA faders and mutes.
If you (perhaps accidentally) hit the STORE button on the surface, X32-Edit crashes out instantly!
On any other bank, it seems safe to push, although quite what it does I have no bloody idea - the knobs at the top change their displayed value, but when you hit EXIT they don't go back to what they were. That, I can live with. A crash, not so much.
This is on Mac, with v1.20, not connected to a console (can't test whether that makes a difference right now, as my router is elsewhere).
Re: X32 v2 RTA
That discussion has continued for some time on the LAB forum:
behringer x32 cracking and popping with 2x S16 connected?
That discussion has continued for some time on the LAB forum:
behringer x32 cracking and popping with 2x S16 connected?