X32 Discussion
- Thread starter Rob Spence
- Start date
Re: X32 Discussion
Works for me, have no problem with repeating tries within 10ms
Works for me, have no problem with repeating tries within 10ms
Re: X32 Discussion
Dear John and Tim,
May I re-encourage you to pm me all the details (firmware and app versions) and a corresponding scene file? I'd really like to find out what is different in your application, as compared to mine.
For the time being, I attached a small xls file for you to juggle with BMP and tapping error values. View attachment tap error.xls Generally the 4th tap is reasonably close to the exact value (as calculated from BMP). It's a compromise, but there is not much mystery about it.
Best,
Jan
Dear John and Tim,
May I re-encourage you to pm me all the details (firmware and app versions) and a corresponding scene file? I'd really like to find out what is different in your application, as compared to mine.
For the time being, I attached a small xls file for you to juggle with BMP and tapping error values. View attachment tap error.xls Generally the 4th tap is reasonably close to the exact value (as calculated from BMP). It's a compromise, but there is not much mystery about it.
Best,
Jan
Re: X32 Discussion
I don't need a spreadsheet, I need the tap tempo to work. Console is 2.04, no ipad in use, everything direct from the surface of the full sized X32. Likewise, there is no showfile as I was operating from a freshly initialized console.
I don't need a spreadsheet, I need the tap tempo to work. Console is 2.04, no ipad in use, everything direct from the surface of the full sized X32. Likewise, there is no showfile as I was operating from a freshly initialized console.
Re: X32 Discussion
I can confirm that I played with a compact at GC a bunch of months back and I posted about it... As the store model with 1.15 firmware... The same as my full size X32...and the tap tempo worked normally...meaning whatever you tapped you got. It seems that this may be the situation as some seem to have a different implementation. Someone needs to find out about this ASAP.
I can confirm that I played with a compact at GC a bunch of months back and I posted about it... As the store model with 1.15 firmware... The same as my full size X32...and the tap tempo worked normally...meaning whatever you tapped you got. It seems that this may be the situation as some seem to have a different implementation. Someone needs to find out about this ASAP.
Re: X32 Discussion
+1000 on the tap tempo issues.
I thought I was doing something wrong or that I somehow lost my ability to tap in time.
Can this be sorted in a future update?
I don't want the machine second guessing me and averaging out what I'm tapping. The last two taps are all I want.
No calculations. No average.
At least give us the option on how the machine can respond; average or real....
Karl.
+1000 on the tap tempo issues.
I thought I was doing something wrong or that I somehow lost my ability to tap in time.
Can this be sorted in a future update?
I don't want the machine second guessing me and averaging out what I'm tapping. The last two taps are all I want.
No calculations. No average.
At least give us the option on how the machine can respond; average or real....
Karl.
Re: X32 Discussion
Are you aware of the fact that tapping includes releasing. It is not the pressing of the knob that counts, but the unpressing. So tapping has to be done staccato, especially the last tap. It works, believe me.
Are you aware of the fact that tapping includes releasing. It is not the pressing of the knob that counts, but the unpressing. So tapping has to be done staccato, especially the last tap. It works, believe me.
Re: X32 Discussion
Uli needs to go buy a TC Electronics D-Two... Used if need be (hahaha, right)... In my opinion, that tap function works the way it should:
No averaging, although I think you CAN specify some averaging. Thought I saw an option somewhere but I've never read the manual. That box is set up so well I've never felt the need to read the manual. I'm bored, so I'm going to download the pdf and read it now.
It can display the delay interval in both ms AND bpm. VERY helpful.
Because of the no averaging, I can jump between 1/8 1/4 1/2 and 1 bar delay times exactly when I need to. Tap tap tap for 1/4 notes for the verse, tap tap tap 1/8 notes for the chorus. I want ONLY the last 2 (TWO!!!) taps to set the delay time. To my non dsp programmer mind, that seems like it should be a HELL of a lot easier to program than using averaging.
If you want to get really fancy, you should add left/right independent polarity switches for the feedback signal. PLEASE focus on getting the tap timing workable first though..
Oh, and for firmware version 4 or whatever, you should think about programming up a good 2 bus compressor such as the SSL 4k comp. Avid did it with the Impact plugin. You should do it and call it the "grey matter comp". Get it? SSL desks are kind of grey... I'm specifically interested in the auto-release setting and the SSL style knee.
That's on the wishlist though... The delay tap fix NEEDS to happen!!
Uli needs to go buy a TC Electronics D-Two... Used if need be (hahaha, right)... In my opinion, that tap function works the way it should:
No averaging, although I think you CAN specify some averaging. Thought I saw an option somewhere but I've never read the manual. That box is set up so well I've never felt the need to read the manual. I'm bored, so I'm going to download the pdf and read it now.
It can display the delay interval in both ms AND bpm. VERY helpful.
Because of the no averaging, I can jump between 1/8 1/4 1/2 and 1 bar delay times exactly when I need to. Tap tap tap for 1/4 notes for the verse, tap tap tap 1/8 notes for the chorus. I want ONLY the last 2 (TWO!!!) taps to set the delay time. To my non dsp programmer mind, that seems like it should be a HELL of a lot easier to program than using averaging.
If you want to get really fancy, you should add left/right independent polarity switches for the feedback signal. PLEASE focus on getting the tap timing workable first though..
Oh, and for firmware version 4 or whatever, you should think about programming up a good 2 bus compressor such as the SSL 4k comp. Avid did it with the Impact plugin. You should do it and call it the "grey matter comp". Get it? SSL desks are kind of grey... I'm specifically interested in the auto-release setting and the SSL style knee.
That's on the wishlist though... The delay tap fix NEEDS to happen!!
Re: X32 Discussion
That is messed up if that's the way that it truly is (like the Flying Faders automated mute on the 90s Neve desks?) That's a freakin dumb way to do it because the fvcking buttons stick in the depressed position on these things!
Normal human beings also tap on the down beat; not the up beat. (you tap your finger, you don't lift if off of something) If Behringer really programmed the tap function to incorporate the up beat of the tap key, it would be one of the dumbest things I've ever heard of.
That is messed up if that's the way that it truly is (like the Flying Faders automated mute on the 90s Neve desks?) That's a freakin dumb way to do it because the fvcking buttons stick in the depressed position on these things!
Normal human beings also tap on the down beat; not the up beat. (you tap your finger, you don't lift if off of something) If Behringer really programmed the tap function to incorporate the up beat of the tap key, it would be one of the dumbest things I've ever heard of.
Re: X32 Discussion
Sarcasm alert
Gee, I've never done this before, only 35 years in the industry.
/sarcasm
I've been tapping tempos for 15 or more years. The X32 doesn't work right, much like the status save. And I've always used a staccato technique...
Sarcasm alert
Gee, I've never done this before, only 35 years in the industry.
/sarcasm
I've been tapping tempos for 15 or more years. The X32 doesn't work right, much like the status save. And I've always used a staccato technique...
Re: X32 Discussion
So, let me get this straight. After I've pushed down on the button, I need to lift off...?
I might need to practice that.
I've only got 25 years in the industry.
I guess it's only when you clock up 30 years+ that you learn to let go..........
/more sarcasm
For what it's worth, my Yamaha MG32/16 had a more predictable tap tempo, although to be fair, it did have a dedicated button for the task.
8)~
~
So, let me get this straight. After I've pushed down on the button, I need to lift off...?
I might need to practice that.
I've only got 25 years in the industry.
I guess it's only when you clock up 30 years+ that you learn to let go..........
/more sarcasm
For what it's worth, my Yamaha MG32/16 had a more predictable tap tempo, although to be fair, it did have a dedicated button for the task.
8)~
~Re: X32 Discussion
I've been mixing live sounds for 42 years. No problems with the delay tap or save.
I've been mixing live sounds for 42 years. No problems with the delay tap or save.
Re: X32 Discussion
I don't think the X32 cares if one is new at tapping or has been doing it for a hundred years, some of us manages just fine, indicating that it works if done "right".
The "right" way might be different from what other consoles and units can handle, but I have never seen anything that doesn't allow me to tap exactly the way I always do, tapping the button like if I was making a sound on a drum with my finger, so that the interval between contacts and interval between releases are identical. I prefer doing the full count of a rhythm, but if for some reason that doesn't work, I do two taps.
I never give up and call the unit broken because it doesn't understand what I'm trying to do, I rather try to understand what it requires me to do, and learn to do that right. We might at some point come to a consensus about what strategy is "best" and ask Behringer to implement that, but rather arrogantly claiming it's "broken" when it clearly isn't is in my mind not the right way forward.
I don't think the X32 cares if one is new at tapping or has been doing it for a hundred years, some of us manages just fine, indicating that it works if done "right".
The "right" way might be different from what other consoles and units can handle, but I have never seen anything that doesn't allow me to tap exactly the way I always do, tapping the button like if I was making a sound on a drum with my finger, so that the interval between contacts and interval between releases are identical. I prefer doing the full count of a rhythm, but if for some reason that doesn't work, I do two taps.
I never give up and call the unit broken because it doesn't understand what I'm trying to do, I rather try to understand what it requires me to do, and learn to do that right. We might at some point come to a consensus about what strategy is "best" and ask Behringer to implement that, but rather arrogantly claiming it's "broken" when it clearly isn't is in my mind not the right way forward.
Re: X32 Discussion
Well sayd, Per.
When somebody is tapping, one is always lifting immediately after the touch. Don't be lasy and finish the last tap and don't rest your finger on the tap button. It is meant for tapping, not for holding. Use your equipement the way it is meant, not the way you should have made it.
Well sayd, Per.
When somebody is tapping, one is always lifting immediately after the touch. Don't be lasy and finish the last tap and don't rest your finger on the tap button. It is meant for tapping, not for holding. Use your equipement the way it is meant, not the way you should have made it.
Re: X32 Discussion
The tap function on my lowly Studiolive(and my Expression) works perfectly....just sayin'. Oh, and it does return to its previous state if rebooted, as does every other board I know of.
The tap function on my lowly Studiolive(and my Expression) works perfectly....just sayin'. Oh, and it does return to its previous state if rebooted, as does every other board I know of.
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Re: X32 Discussion
AVID gives you a choice of press or release, but I don't expect that at the price of the X32.
The whole point is that I've worked scores of devices that use tap input. Some of them use the release, others the press... but I've managed to adapt to all of them. Whatever the X32 wants is counter-intuitive to every other device I've used, and I've made repeated adjustments to my technique in order to find the happy place. So far there isn't one. Perhaps I need to send it to the Care facility in Las Vegas for their investigation.
AVID gives you a choice of press or release, but I don't expect that at the price of the X32.
The whole point is that I've worked scores of devices that use tap input. Some of them use the release, others the press... but I've managed to adapt to all of them. Whatever the X32 wants is counter-intuitive to every other device I've used, and I've made repeated adjustments to my technique in order to find the happy place. So far there isn't one. Perhaps I need to send it to the Care facility in Las Vegas for their investigation.
Re: X32 Discussion
The "save" is returning to prior state following an unexpected power interruption. My lowly Yamaha 01v96 will return to it's exact, pre-power failure status, the X32? Maybe. I carry a good UPS/AVR so it's not as big a deal for me as it may be for others. This has been discussed way up thread, too....
The "save" is returning to prior state following an unexpected power interruption. My lowly Yamaha 01v96 will return to it's exact, pre-power failure status, the X32? Maybe. I carry a good UPS/AVR so it's not as big a deal for me as it may be for others. This has been discussed way up thread, too....
Re: X32 Discussion
AGAIN...I submit that some units work differently...the time I noticed it was because it was the first thing I checked because the tap delay literally gets used more than any other function during a show. So if I mis tap on the iPad I have to wait 3 secs to start tapping again! 3 secs during a song is an eternity, especially if after that I have to change pages to get back to faders.
I think users who claim a normal function have a different function. I have experienced it so I know it exists...just don't know how or why. Like Tim, I have been tapping delays since at least the Roland SDE 1000's... With the playmate input for a momentary switch...and how stupid did it operate as the first tap reset the time, and the next 2 set the delay! At least then I could fix it as quickly as I could tap.
AGAIN...I submit that some units work differently...the time I noticed it was because it was the first thing I checked because the tap delay literally gets used more than any other function during a show. So if I mis tap on the iPad I have to wait 3 secs to start tapping again! 3 secs during a song is an eternity, especially if after that I have to change pages to get back to faders.
I think users who claim a normal function have a different function. I have experienced it so I know it exists...just don't know how or why. Like Tim, I have been tapping delays since at least the Roland SDE 1000's... With the playmate input for a momentary switch...and how stupid did it operate as the first tap reset the time, and the next 2 set the delay! At least then I could fix it as quickly as I could tap.